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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:28 AM 
Trolling like there is no tomorrow!
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I saw this on ESPN Outdoors and thought it very sad and reflective of how the administration handles other legislation that is unpopular - just turn the people off.

Quote:
The Obama administration will accept no more public input for a federal strategy that could prohibit U.S. citizens from fishing the nation's oceans, coastal areas, Great Lakes, and even inland waters.
...
we see NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration) and the administration planning the future of recreational fishing access in America based on a similar agenda of these same groups and other Big Green anti-use organizations, through an Executive Order by the President. The current U.S. direction with fishing is a direct parallel to what happened in Canada with hunting: The negative economic impacts on hard working American families and small businesses are being ignored.

"In spite of what we hear daily in the press about the President's concern for jobs and the economy and contrary to what he stated in the June order creating this process, we have seen no evidence from NOAA or the task force that recreational fishing and related jobs are receiving any priority."

Led by NOAA's Jane Lubchenco, the task force has shown no overt dislike of recreational angling, but its indifference to the economic, social and biological value of the sport has been deafening.

Additionally, Lubchenco and others in the administration have close ties to environmental groups who would like nothing better than to ban recreational angling. And evidence suggests that these organizations have been the engine behind the task force since before Obama issued a memo creating it last June.
...
As more evidence of collusion, the green groups began clamoring for an Executive Order to implement the task force's recommendations even before the public comment period ended in February. Fishing advocates had no idea that this was coming.

Perhaps not so coincidentally, the New York Times reported on Feb. 12 that "President Obama and his team are preparing an array of actions using his executive power to advance energy, environmental, fiscal and other domestic policy priorities."

Morlock fears that "what we're seeing coming at us is an attempted dismantling of the science-based fish and wildlife model that has served us so well. There's no basis in science for the agendas of these groups who are trying to push the public out of being able to fish and recreate.

"Conflicts (user) are overstated and problems are manufactured. It's all just an excuse to put us off the water."

In the wake of the task force's framework document, the Congressional Sportsmen's Foundation (CSF) and its partners in the U.S. Recreational Fishing & Boating Coalition against voiced their concerns to the administration.

"Some of the potential policy implications of this interim framework have the potential to be a real threat to recreational anglers who not only contribute billions of dollars to the economy and millions of dollars in tax revenues to support fisheries conservation, but who are also the backbone of the American fish and wildlife conservation ethic," said CSF President Jeff Crane.

Morlock, a member of the CSF board, added, "There are over one million jobs in America supported coast to coast by recreational fishing. The task force has not included any accountability requirements in their reports for evaluating or mitigating how the new policies they are drafting will impact the fishing industry or related economies.

"Given that the scope of this process appears to include a new set of policies for all coastal and inland waters of the United States, the omission of economic considerations is inexcusable."

This is not the only access issue threatening the public's right to fish, but it definitely is the most serious, according to Chris Horton, national conservation director for BASS.

"With what's being created, the same principles could apply inland as apply to the oceans," he said. "Under the guise of 'marine spatial planning' entire watersheds could be shut down, even 2,000 miles up a river drainage from the ocean.


No, nothing has happened yet. But this could be an interesting one to watch. Recreational fishing is a big deal all across the country. If this administration acts to ban any form of recreational fishing they will anger a huge, cross-demographic, voting block - from the businesses that build and support it down to the angler themselves.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:18 AM 
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Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


Quote:
Recreational fishing is a big deal all across the country.


http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/sfa/Partnershi ... /index.htm

Quote:
saltwater recreational fishing is a major economic driver generating more than $30 billion in economic impact and supporting nearly 350,000 jobs nationwide.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/200 ... nomy_N.htm

Quote:
Spending on health care totals about $2.5 trillion


Quote:
Employment in the huge health care sector has grown by about 427,000 jobs — nearly 3% — since the recession began in December 2007, and totaled 15.5 million jobs in April, the latest month for which U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics figures were available.


Given the relative sizes, I guess I'm pretty glad that the President has put his priorities in the right place. Hell, as you said...

Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


Oh those poor sport fisherman who *might* be impacted a little bit! Their plight is obviously as bad as people with no insurance facing financial disaster when they get into a medical accident.

Again, though....

Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:26 AM 
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Fribur wrote:
Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


Quote:
Recreational fishing is a big deal all across the country.


http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/sfa/Partnershi ... /index.htm

Quote:
saltwater recreational fishing is a major economic driver generating more than $30 billion in economic impact and supporting nearly 350,000 jobs nationwide.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/health/200 ... nomy_N.htm

Quote:
Spending on health care totals about $2.5 trillion


Quote:
Employment in the huge health care sector has grown by about 427,000 jobs — nearly 3% — since the recession began in December 2007, and totaled 15.5 million jobs in April, the latest month for which U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics figures were available.


Given the relative sizes, I guess I'm pretty glad that the President has put his priorities in the right place. Hell, as you said...

Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


Oh those poor sport fisherman who *might* be impacted a little bit! Their plight is obviously as bad as people with no insurance facing financial disaster when they get into a medical accident.

Again, though....

Quote:
No, nothing has happened yet.


TLDR version, Fribur doesn't fish.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:28 AM 
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Krby:

Any idea why they'd want to increase fishing regulation in the first place?

And is this recreational (small-scale) fishing only, or big industrial fisheries too? If it's both, who will be effected more?

Your source (even the bits you snipped out) didn't talk about any of the reasons for the bill, or even the mechanics of how it might actually impact anglers. I do some fly fishing, and I really enjoy it, so I'm sympathetic... but I need something more than emotional appeals before I get on board.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:40 AM 
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What does this have to do with health care? I'm confused


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 11:55 AM 
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Given the relative sizes, I guess I'm pretty glad that the President has put his priorities in the right place.

By the way, that answer to your question is a quote of what I said in the original post. Reading is tech.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 12:15 PM 
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I have 19 years in at NOAA (yikes!) but I'm a completely different part (nautical charting/crappy programmer) so I don't have any interesting to add. :p


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 12:46 PM 
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The "reason" is they want to stop overfishing, but the way they are proposing it is to stop ALL fishing.

In earlier articles they mentioned why this is could be an issue more

Quote:
President Barack Obama quietly created the task force with a June 12 memo. Staffed with "senior policy-level officials" from Interior, Commerce, Agriculture, Homeland Security and other departments and agencies, the task force provides a structure and a mechanism for closures of sport fisheries not only in the blue and coastal waters of oceans, but inland, starting with the Great Lakes.

Of course, that is not the stated intent. The President said it was created "To succeed in protecting the oceans, coasts, and Great Lakes, the United States needs to act within a unifying framework under a clear national policy, including a comprehensive, ecosystem-based framework for the long-term conservation and use of our resources."

Yet those with interests in recreational fishing say early indications are that many in the administration want to take it in the direction of recreational fishing closures under the guise of better protecting those resources. They claim evidence of that can be seen in the task force's Interim Report, released on Sept. 10.

"We are completely baffled as to why the task force failed to acknowledge or include any mention of the key aspects of recreational fishing that were presented to them in detail on more than one occasion," said Phil Morlock, director of environmental affairs for Shimano American Corp./Shimano Canada Ltd. "The significant number of jobs and the economy that more than 60 million American anglers support, and the major conservation efforts by people who fish in all regions of the country, were completely ignored.

"No distinction between the obvious dramatic differences between recreational fishing and commercial harvest methods was made. This is the result of a 90-day fire-drill process, as ordered by the President that, not surprisingly, lacks balance, clarity, and quality in the end product.


This has nothing to do with healthcare, Frib just wants to put his hyperbole for healthcare on every topic.

It has everything to do with JOBS and the ECONOMY. Why do they want to think about across the board governmental action that will negatively impact jobs now is beyond my comprehension.

Quote:
Recreational and commercial fishing is big business in the United States, worth about $185 billion in sales in 2006, NOAA said. Fishing supports more than 2 million jobs, the agency said.

Although many species are overfished, there is only one marine fish species on the endangered list, the smalltooth sawfish in waters off the coast of Florida.

"We have more species that are recovering than are declining, so in terms of the ones we know enough about, the U.S. is actually doing a pretty good job," Cowan said.


It is a good thing that this president is so open and honest with all of us and is able to effectively manage all sorts of crisis.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:11 PM 
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krby71 wrote:
The "reason" is they want to stop overfishing, but the way they are proposing it is to stop ALL fishing.

Okay, that is a strong and testable claim. If it is true, then I agree that this legislation is fucked up and needs to be reworked. Can you provide some evidence for your claim? Ideally, this would be the text of the Interim Report mentioned in your link, but some other reputable source with links to the actual legislation would be great too.

I'd also be interested to hear any information you have about the relative impacts the legislation would have on recreational anglers vs. big industrial fisheries.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 1:28 PM 
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Quote:
This has nothing to do with healthcare, Frib just wants to put his hyperbole for healthcare on every topic.


This is interesting to me, because it was precisely your hyperbole about the MASSIVE recreational fishing industry that I was trying to put in context. Hell, we sell more pet food in the US than the size of this industry and it's "huge voting block."

This is a blip that you are trying to build into something big and scary. And... you said it yourself---

Quote:
nothing has happened


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 2:09 PM 
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Quote:
Okay, that is a strong and testable claim. If it is true, then I agree that this legislation is fucked up and needs to be reworked. Can you provide some evidence for your claim? Ideally, this would be the text of the Interim Report mentioned in your link, but some other reputable source with links to the actual legislation would be great too.


Well, like the first sentence of the linked post says..."a federal strategy that could prohibit U.S. citizens from fishing the nation's oceans, coastal areas, Great Lakes, and even inland waters."

Typically when someone says something in that manner, what they're really doing is saying, "They want to stop us from fishing in this one place. Said place has water. Ergo, they want us to stop fishing in places that have water."


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 2:35 PM 
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This is a non-story. Let's panic about it!


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:21 PM 
Trolling like there is no tomorrow!
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Obama sneezes, could have negative impact on climate change.

Needs more conservative blog copypasta. Keep diggin'.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 6:36 PM 
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With increasing dead zones in our oceans, I believe it is time to ban fishing across the planet.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:41 PM 
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Wait a sec Fribur. If you're touting jobs as a reason to justify the focus spent on health care over this issue.. then why aren't you at all concerned about the 11 million jobs lost since the recession began? Why isn't that a higher priority than healthcare? Normally you guys are quick with the 'omg teh federal gubments can focus on more than 1 thing" argument, so why doesn't it apply in your case?

Here's a great link from bob Herbert about the economy. It's awesome that Obama is falling into the same trap that George HW Bush did - it really is the economy, stupid.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/09/opini ... rbert.html


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:48 PM 
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I was only comparing Obama's priorities compared to krby's. The point was only at the ridiculous tin foil hat approach of krby, and said nothing about all those crazy things you brought up here.

Give it up, bud. Maybe you should go back to the embassy conversation and post some more about it.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:55 PM 
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The embassy conversation about all of the campaign doners who got cushy jobs?


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:59 PM 
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joxur wrote:
The embassy conversation about all of the campaign doners who got cushy jobs?


No, go fish.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:19 AM 
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Quote:
What does this have to do with health care? I'm confused


Billions of fish don't health care.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:20 AM 
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have ^


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:15 AM 
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Following the lead of an ESPNOutdoors.com opinion writer, who provided no evidence for his claim that a federal strategy "could prohibit U.S. citizens from fishing," right-wing blogs have advanced the outlandish charge that Obama "wants to ban sport fishing." These media outlets cited the Interagency Ocean Policy Task Force's interim report on coastal and marine planning, but the task force has proposed nothing of the sort.

Source


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 9:59 AM 
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Wow, that source page is downright comical. =(

It's pretty typical, though. Looks like fishermen are in front of the death panels, now!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 10:58 AM 
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And a fun time was had by all!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:41 AM 
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