http://news.yahoo.com/video/us-15749625 ... N0aHVtYg--

http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/01/01/new.laws/index.html

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Devil

Build a man a fire, and he's warm for the night.
Set a man on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.

I don't understand the sad face.

Because the only thing conservatives hate more than activist judges are legislators adding laws to clarify what is legal.

I don't know, I won't say all new laws are bad...especially ones that clarify or update old laws. But some, I'm sure are just ridiculous...such as this California law.

"A California measure that limits trans fat in restaurant food also takes effect January 1. Enacted in 2008, it requires restaurants to use oils, margarines and shortenings that have less than half a gram of trans fat per serving. A similar provision will apply to baked goods in 2011."

It's worthy of the crooked frown, imo.

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I hear paint on walls no longer has lead too They've even limited me from handling asbestos. Darn interfering government!

Although, unlike those products, you can consume a pretty hefty amount of trans fat and not have any problems. Increases risk for sure, but some people's systems are able to handle fatty foods better than others. I only worry how far they'll take that kind of nonsense. Hey, we don't need donuts or cookies since they're non-essential to our diet and too fatty!! I'd prefer the freedom to choose, if anything. I really don't think you promote a healthy society by shoving it down people's throats(quite literally); if anything I'd contend that promotes bad habits by making people feel like they're being pushed(which, depending on the person, may decrease their motivation) instead of being healthy by their own merits.

Don't get me wrong, I think making a big stink over the fact that there are 40,000 new laws on the books is a bit silly. A large percentage are probably simply revisions and other nonsense that doesn't make a shred of difference in daily life. The trans fat laws irk me, though. I hate to quote(paraphrase?) Khan on this one, but... If I'm going to have a motherfucking cookie, don't give me that diet shit. Put all the motherfucking sugar and fat you can put in it.

Personally, I'm maybe 5-ish pounds over where I should be. I don't eat much of that kind of crap, but if someone wants to, I have no right to tell them they can't. Hell, I'd say the same if someone is really desperate to chow down on some lead or asbestos, but it's not quite the same either way.

The law doesn't tell them that they can't. It's a restriction on what a restaurant can serve, which is really nothing new.

My understanding was that they could serve trans fat(at least more prevalently) prior to 2005-2006 when all the trans fat laws started to take effect. Correct me if I'm wrong there. If it's labeled on the menu, I don't see what the big deal is nor the necessity for a law. Obviously we can eat what we choose, but that becomes a little more difficult when you can't actually... find it =) I feel the same way about restaurants though, I believe they should be free to serve what they want so long as it's clearly labeled. There are always going to be certain risks where someone might make a mistake and order something they don't want. People who are allergic, diabetics, and all manner of other disorders/diseases.

Unfortunately the movement has taken enough hold that if someone were to actually bother to seek it out, you'll have enormous difficulty finding anything in the grocery *without* a "this has no trans fat" label. So, basically, so much for choice. I'd say it's at least partly a result of all the legal wranglings.

Just too much government trying to dictate health. It's the same kind of crap that we see where they legislate some forms of gambling. Just because a significant number of people do it irresponsibly(or are prone to it somehow), it's suddenly something that no one can do without serious consequences. I prefer freedom and choice.

Because you actively seek out trans-fat when you eat? You taste the difference?

My mistake...what I meant there was that it's nothing new that restaurants and food in general have a lot of rules and regulations that they have to follow.



I don't see anything about food in grocery stores having to abide by the law. You're free to buy the trans-fattiest food you can find.

If you see a ton of products that have no trans-fat, you're seeing the result of the businesses doing so willingly because they think it'll sell better.

If you buy a product in a grocery store, it must label the trans fat you you know what you are getting. In a restaurant you generally don't know what exactly goes into the food prep. While I am generally a small government person, I do believe this is a decent law. I don't want my hand held, but I do want to be protected from things I cannot see to decide for myself.

I have very sensitive taste buds, and personally I felt like I could. I have some McDonald's maybe once every month or so, and I felt like before the ban it tasted significantly better. Apparently there was a study where taste testers did detect a slight difference, so that wouldn't be all that surprising. Obviously I don't rummage the store shelves for it, but I have a problem when someone who does want to seek out something like that simply doesn't have much of a choice because the government decided with one broad brush for everyone what is and isn't healthy.



That, or they're worried that the government will propose new laws banning products with trans fat and are just moving ahead of time to avoid hassle. As an example, Kraft Foods was sued over Oreo having trans fat a few years back.

I don't just care about myself not having a choice. As I said, restaurants should be able to serve what they want as well. They have had their freedom imposed on as well. It's not just a label in some of these states/cities, they just can't choose to serve it at all.

My freedom was imposed on by limiting the speed of my car to 55 miles per hour on the drive in to work this morning. Gottdam gubment!

Obviously you can't impose on other people's freedoms, which is why speed limits are there =p Cmon Leo, better analogy! Now, granted, we all pay a price when some guy decides to become overweight via fatty foods - however, it's also a choice by society to use tax money to help pay for that guy's wellbeing.

Just for argument's sake, what's the difference between limiting what food I eat by banning trans-fat and limiting how much of my money I spend by taxing me to pay for healthcare?

Where do we draw the line between acceptable limits and those that aren't? Both are in the public's best interest (and the govt's, to have healthy citizens).

I assume you mean my example of where society pays? The difference is that we have made a choice, as a society, to pay and help them even though they have made poor choices and gotten fat. We don't have to, but we have elected to. If some guy had gotten fat on his own and ended up paying through the nose for his own medical bills, that would be his prerogative and he wouldn't hurt anyone else in the process. Same deal with trans-fat, it doesn't need to hurt anyone except for the person consuming it irresponsibly. Arguably society always pays as a whole to a degree since we may end up being less productive, but that's not much different from anyone else's poor/lazy lifestyle choices.

People make all sorts of unhealthy decisions every day, and society pays for it. IMO it's too subjective from person to person. People can make a few unhealthy decisions, but actually end up being very healthy overall. I knew a guy who was at least a hundred pounds overweight, but was actually more healthy than he was when he was 20 pounds over. Body types differ. This guy could hike up a mountain trial at running speed for several hours without stopping. It's a pretty unusual situation, but it happens.

It's simply not the government's job to dictate it.

One thing to point out Venen is that regulating trans fats isn't limiting fats in your diet or even limiting food, it's limiting a manufactured chemical product. You can't milk a cow or slaughter a pig to get trans-fats, you have to mix polyunsaturated oils with hydrogen atoms under high pressure to create partially hydrogenated fats to mimic the appearance and functuality of natural fats.

So to me, it's no different than regulating any other manufactured product that was found to cause health concerns.

I would like to point out that there is no way to "responsibly" consume trans fat. Seriously just don't touch the stuff

They're not dictating what you can eat or how healthy you are. They're dictating the amount of an artificially produced chemical that an establishment can serve it's unwitting customers.