That's one for a judge. It won't matter in this case. By the officers own admission in his report, he stopped on the porch steps and made the false arrest there. A fact backed up by the photograph posted earlier in this thread.

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Sorry Rugen, you are just plain wrong. I have 2 cops, female lesbians actually that live across the street 3 houses down and I just stopped them as they were walking their 4month old twins around the block and asked them what the law is. I can't stand outside in my front yard screaming at anyone, in or out of my yard. If I am screaming like gates was, I am disturbing the peace, or to use a fancy Law term, being a nuisance so as to be a detriment to other quality of life of others.

<quote from them>
Gates is just a drama queen is the purest sense of the word and the cop wasn't going to put up with it. I say good for him and I hope he told gates to suck a fat one today over beers with obama.

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

and before you all ask, yes, they are pretty damn sexy...

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

Color me surprised that a cop is going to back up another cop. Even at their worst, they seem to stick together out of some misguided notion that they can take care of it in private later, "away from the cameras", never mind the wrong happening now that could be corrected by speaking up.

I'll stick to the judge's interpretation of the law. That's their job, after all.

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I'll stick to my common sense. Judges aren't always connected to reality of real life for most Americans. Letter of the law applied to real life doesn't always work.

So common sense. I figure I'm going to have to deal with something bad by telling a cop to fuck off repeatedly and as loud as I can. Regardless of where I am standing. Despite the 1st amendment.

That's why he was actually charged and will be doing community service or something similar for his "Crime".

Oh...wait...

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I've been arrested for being a douche in public once.

I got to spend four hours in a holding cell to sober up, then they just released me.

Then again, they arrested like 20-30 other people for the same thing and we all got the same treatment...

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World of Warcraft: Kallaystra, Gweila, Steakumn, Tarathia [ Feathermoon/Horde ]

Hope this side story gets worked out. Sad.

lol

Biden was apparently drinking a non-alcoholic beer.

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Yeah, I wish Gates would speak up too and apologize to the officer for being a complete asshole to a public servant who was just trying to do his job.

On a side not, this morning Ashley (one of the cops down the street) was ending her morning run and stops me as I am getting my paper and asked what my "Internet buddies" thought of her feelings on the subject.

She laughed and called you a "Bitter old fag", Rugen. I sprayed coffee all over the street. It was too funny.

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

Awww, Rugen's comment by proxy must have hit a nerve. So that's all she could come back with. Sad. =[

As opposed to a "sweet young lesbian."

Which, by the way, requires photos as evidence.

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What'd you expect her to say while talking to Khan on the street? Some Shakespearean prose?

Ah more slurs allegedly from cops. Just what the thread needs. *sigh*

As far as the black cop complaining about Uncle Tom shit, the reality I've seen with every cop I've known, is that they're blue first. And many minority cops tend to be more racist towards their own group than others. As one black cop I've known opinioned, they [the people he dealt with on the streets] were n*****s...he and people he knew [outside of the job] were blacks, and there's a fundemental difference.

It's the racism of the sort where people say, "I hate X group"...but Bob your friend is an X! Well, Bob's not slur on X, he's the exception.

When police are dealing every day with people they deem scumbags, they tend to group the people they're dealing with all as scumbags. It's not just poor minorities. People working other types of crime where they're predominately dealing with a higher economic group are still dealing with specific groups of people due to location and region. In Southern CA if you work in a specific location and deal with specific crime types, the majority of the people you'll be dealing with are....Armenian. I'm sure this leads to racist comments about Armenians, and they get lumped as a whole. This is despite the fact that the large group that live in that area from Armenia are mostly law abiding people who maintain close cultural ties to each other and their heritage.

Anyway, I'll close with a story I've heard more than once from a police officer I know. He was partnered with a black officer and in the course of dealing with some suspects, one of the suspects [who was black] who was dealing with the white officer, broke away and made an appeal to the black officer, calling him 'brother'. The black officer knocked him to the ground and said, 'I'm not your 'brother' nigger, that man there...he's my brother'.

Every cop I've ever known has laughed at that story, and nodded knowingly. For the very few who may not get it...they're both blue. The man he knocked down wouldn't think twice about stabbing him or shooting him, regardless of skin color. He made the appeal because scumbags will do anything they can when they're twisting in the wind. The officer knows he better be blue first and always, because his real brothers are the ones who are going to roll back up for him.

So it was explained to me, when I was appalled at the racism in the story, and didn't 'get it'. I understand what they're saying, but I don't find racism amusing, nor mistreatment of people...even when they're scumbags.

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Doing something to a black person isn't racism.

(A simple point I think a lot of folks have forgotten.)

A bit of lameness on both sides really. You've got people who cry foul at anything done to any minority whatsoever and labeled as racism. Then on the other extreme, you've got people who insist that we're a post-racism society and no action could be racist, ever.

A lot of people have also forgotten that it's easy to say no racism exists from the armchair of comfy surburbia.

Exactly.

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a whole lot of nothing here.

You could always try to contribute. We might actually be surprised, who knows?

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at this point, what's there to discuss? cop was a douche, gates was a douche. they can live happily forever in their douchery.

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World of Warcraft: Kallaystra, Gweila, Steakumn, Tarathia [ Feathermoon/Horde ]

In this we agree.

I'm still boggled at the beer at the white house thing. Really? Honestly? You can't fucking fix DADT, but you can invite two spatting mofos to the white house for beer? THAT is what you are going to focus on?

Fuck, I am starting to regret my vote.

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Joxur incoming in 3....2....

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haha!! I had the post written already but canceled it!

Caption this pic.

honestly, you and me both, though DADT isn't at the tops of my list for the reasoning.

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World of Warcraft: Kallaystra, Gweila, Steakumn, Tarathia [ Feathermoon/Horde ]

You know, you guys mock the beer thing - and I get the "easy" cynicism, but isn't this what leadership is about? Bringing together people who have opposing points of view and finding a common ground.

By all accounts, Gates and Crowley share a common interest in limiting profiles, but found themselves on opposite sides of stupidity.

I get that a lot of this is smoke and mirrors, but that's alot of what leading is about.

I dunno... I find the situation a tad laughable, but I think it shows how much better Obama is than Bush in these terms: Obama spoke without thinking and {mostly} admitted he was not fully informed. Do you see Bush EVER doing that?

You know you're in trouble when you're celebrating someone being incrementally better than one of the worst presidents ever. Hooray for mediocrity!

Yep!

Welcome to how class - moreso than race - drives things.

Guys, im worried that this will send the wrong message to young americans and drive them to drink beer

Mistreatment of scumbags certainly doesn't keep me up at night.

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Kuwen Furyblades
Hunter of Memento Reejeryn
Champion of Faydark

So where's the racism in that story?

for a lot of people, the word "nigger" = automatic racism, whether that's the intent or not.

derogatory? sure. racist? not automatically.

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World of Warcraft: Kallaystra, Gweila, Steakumn, Tarathia [ Feathermoon/Horde ]

I never said it was incrementally better

I noted this is one (of several) ways Obama is better than Bush. Frankly, it is still too early in his presidency to judge Obama in an honest way. A lot of people feel he is moving too fast and too recklessly, which may be a legit criticism, but most presidents realize they have a short-term mandate after an election.

Sadly, that is the nature of politics. Careful, deliberate planning is not rewarded.

I just caught that the cop that wrote this WAS NOT the police officer that took Prof. Gates into custody.

Tarot, feel free to trot 3 houses down and across the street and have a chat with them. Anyone who has been to my house in the past 3yrs knows of them.

Besides, isn't one gay person calling another gay person a "Fag" just as socially acceptable in their community as one black person calling another "Nigger" is in theirs?

And I hope your friend who was partnered with the black officer who called a black man a nigger and pushed him to the ground was turned in and dismissed from his job. But I'm sure he wasn't.

Here, let me help you down the steps you lying old fuck.

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

As acceptable as a gay man calling them bull dykes? I dunno, have never tried (and most likely never will, there are smarter ways to get back at people who piss you off). *shrug*

I dunno, still comes off as whatever you told her that someone said on some internet forums in response to her comment hit a nerve in this woman. Which is quite amusing.

What's more amusing though, is bringing up someone's sexuality into a discussion where someone's opinion on a situation has nothing to do with their sexuality. =P

I'm not entirely sure that's accurate.

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I can tell you this Khan, that *every* police officer I know, when asked a question AS A POLICE OFFICER...even from friends, is careful with their words. I can't imagine a single one of them using a slur for someone else to pass on as their words as a police officer.

Let alone publically.

I wouldn't do this...but let's assume I find out their names since I now know their address since it's not difficult to know yours. And I call their department and complain about it.

If asked, do you really think they're going to say, "Oh yeah, a guy asked me a question as an officer for a public message board on the internet and I said the guy he was talking to sounded like a 'bitter old fag'"? Or do you think they simply won't recall it?

And yes, I've heard officers use slurs before, in their own person, in private...though I don't let it slide.

Can't imagine a single one stupid enough to do what you're saying she did though. Then again in this thread we've seen officer stupid enough to send e-mails full of racial slurs to a newspaper...so clearly they exist.

It's for her sake though that I use 'allegedly'. I'm sure she'd appreciate you being such a good friend though that you're willing to potentially throw her under the bus to score against someone you've had issues with for years. Luckily for her, she's got plausible deniability if someone were enough of a douchebag to make issue of it.

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And to answer your question, that person no longer has a badge, and did not when I heard that story. [If they had, I hope that I would have reported them, but as it wasn't an issue that problem never came up.] It was not over that incident, though it was over an abuse of power incident where they attempted to badge their way out of a problem. I do not know if they were fired, quit before being fired, or were simply advised to quit. I may have been told, but I simply don't recall it.

It's not shocking that someone who abuses their authority finally does themselves in. I just wish it happened every time. :\ No good officer wants people like that out there, it makes their jobs more difficult. That plus the fact that many suspects are extremely good liars is why almost every officer today L O V E S the cameras in their units. Many still carry around personal recorders as well to protect themselves. A good officer has nothing to hide, and should be aware that any time they speak as a police officer, that their words could be scrutinized by others.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Today that answer should be 'everyone'.

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Which is precisely why if this "friend" actually exists? I'm not losing any sleep over it. She would have already proven my point about some people in uniform quite plainly. Yet another self inflated sense of authority that bristles when someone is actually informed enough to know better and doesn't just accept their word that they are the end all be all of the law. In frustration, they end up resorting to the same old tiresome tactics of schoolyard bullies, intimidation and humiliation, because they just can't stand it when someone doesn't just accept their authority at face value and sees them for the waste of space and disgrace to the badge that they are.

If she's real (which I sort of doubt), it seems my mutant gift for smelling shitty cops a mile away got an upgrade to 1,000 miles away.

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Something tells me all cops smell shitty to you, which makes your "mutant gift" kind of lame.

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A good cop just doing his/her job would find me to the nicest person they've ever dealt with. Ask the last one to give me a speeding ticket. heh. It is only when they cross the line of my rights that they hit the brick wall. It is when they try to force their way across it that they have a fight. And I never assume that they have my best interests at heart. You gotta watch out for yourself.

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We need to get Israel and Palestine to smoke some crac...err shoot heroine (less "racist") at the white house for peac... errr agree to disagree talks.

I thought all the other cops found the story to be funny?

I said every cop I've known has laughed at it. Apparently you don't know too many on the job. I've also known many to laugh at 'crispy critters' too (people burned to death), and laughingly talk about how it smells like BBQ. And many, many darker things as well.

It's simply a way to deal with it. My spouse has a very twisted sense of humor too. But it's armor to deal with the shit even he has to deal with. Death cases bother him, the death of children really bothers him. I've seen officers crack 'jokes' at horrific shit they've had to deal with, and I've watched them drink themselves into puking oblivion too. My spouse doesn't do the drinking thing...anymore. He did prior to our marriage. No, now I've seen him spend days puking with stress over a case. Or be depressed for days over some of the bullshit. Or not be able to sleep while dealing with a death case that killed both a delivering mother and her infant. Or the case with the child with bone cancer who's parents were seeing a 'healer' who could cure it with herbs (someone previously prosecuted who was scamming purely for profit. Killing a child for money.) Or the chinese doctor who spit in his patients mouths and molested women and children in his home while doing exams (hope he liked his extradition! since his last point of origin wasn't China my spouse made sure that fucker got deported).

And then of course there's other things, like every year when he gets depressed over a former partner who ate his gun over a case around the time the guy died. Or another friend who was killed on the job...trying to cash his paycheck when he walked into a robbery that he had to take action on because they were pistol whipping a box boy...and he died in the shoot out.

Yeah, they laugh. And they'll tell jokes that are beyond fucked up. It's not that they find it 'funny' though, it's that if you don't laugh, you'd cry. Or worse.

I wouldn't do the job for any amount of money. I think I would have a very difficult time respecting some people's rights. I can't imagine conducting an interview with a child rapist and being cordial...among other things.

And for some that armor becomes warped and twisted, killing any empathy they might have had for *anyone* they deal with. They come to the job with contempt for humanity and begin to believe they have the 'right' to decide right and wrong. That's when good cops go bad. Or they start to have a sense of entitlement, and they go bad....seeing how much criminals profit and why shouldn't they? Or their methods of coping become vices and addiction, destroying their personal lives, and sometimes their professional ones.

There are douchebag cops who start the job wanting a badge for all the wrong reasons. They didn't get weeded out for whatever reason; maybe the dept. didn't have a good psych. eval. or background check. *shrug*. More often....my opinion based on what I've both seen and heard, I think most of the cops I've heard about going south were once good cops (and very good people) who simply got eaten up by it. I'm not excusing it, that doesn't excuse it. It simply explains it.

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Uh huh. What part of "Walking their twins around the block" did you not understand? I dunno about California, but here they don't wear their uniforms during off time. They are neighbors who happen to be cops who stopped to chat. I asked what they thought about the whole situation, they replied. Next day, 1 stops to chat and asks about the discussion.I told them about the heated discussion on the boards and rugen's apparent disdain for anything blue and offered up that he was also a vocal gay rights proponent on the boards. She laughed and called him a bitter old fag. Not as an officer, as a neighbor.




Goolly gee, I saw those episodes on [insert any TV cop show name here]. Ripping off broadcast TV shows for material now Tarot? Come on, you can do better than that.



How convenient for the discussion.

Go ahead and toss them under the bus tarot, how ridiculous would you sound telling on one gay person laughingly calling another one a fag, while off duty AND on maternity leave. WOW LOL,

Trust me Ghosthook, it apparently struck more of a nerve with you than it did with her.

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

I'm sure she'd never recall it Khan. And I'm sure if she said it, you'd never mention this thread to her.

PS, not that it matters Khan but you can PM me for my spouse's cell phone number. I'm sure he'd be happy to share with you the name of his former partner who ate his gun, its public record after all, and it was a high profile case nationally, I can guarentee you're familiar with it. As far as his other friend, as he's the only Glendora police officer killed in the line of duty, you can easily look up Louie Pompei. There's also a stretch of highway named after him. Additionally since my spouse is currently union president, he can give you an expert opinion on what would happen to a police officer when asked a question as a police officer was reported to use slurs in the response.

Of course since your shower wank material happens to sound exactly like you, I'm sure it's a moot issue anyway. :lol

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We should just get Rugen and Tarot together for a marathon watching of The Shield.

Haha, you just keep tossing this out there. What part of off duty and on maternity leave do you not understand? Was I interviewing her while she was in uniform? Uhhh... no?

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

Because she's probably the type of person that would report, "POLICE OFFICER MAKES BIGOTED REMARKS!" if said lesbian off-duty lady said, "Bitter old fag" to her.

I think she's "throwing it out there" because YOU asked them the question "as a police officer." You didn't have a reason to ask them, except for the fact that they were police officers. In other words, you were asking them, "As a police officer, do you think blah blah blah." This means by context, they ARE answering it "as a police officer."

You would think this is obvious, sir.

You may have missed, Fribs, where the separate halves of the conversation happened.

Actually, I probably have, if that matters at all. Honestly, his story didn't totally make sense to me at all, but it's possible I missed something because of skimming.

This conversation didn't happen all at once? As in, XKhanx asked the question in one location, and they answered it somewhere else? This matters?

Yah. Go read the stories again!

In short: Khan asked the ladies what they thought as cops. Blah blah. Next day, one of the ladies ask him how the discussion was going, he tells her, she say Rugen is a "bitter old fag".

Conclusion: The question was asked because they were cops. The discussion the next day was just between two neighbors.

Addendum: None of that should matter unless we're all trying to be sensationalist media types looking for a big headline or something about the evil gay-bashing cop lady.

oh... huh.

Since its the same topic, if it were me (being the cop) I'm sure I would still be guarded about it.

I'm with Fribur on this one (wanker), though you guys are way overthinking things.

Haven't we had the whole "what you say even when off duty or not on the job DOES matter" debate a thousand times?

Yes, we have, and the conclusion is usually, "Only because some people are, maybe yourself included, a huge douchebag looking to make an issue out of a non-issue."

A gay person said fag, STOP THE PRESSES! ALERT THE INTERNET!