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 Post subject: Harder line on Israel
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:48 AM 
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I like it. Specifically the language about how continued settlement growth is unacceptable.
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“Israelis must acknowledge that just as Israel’s right to exist cannot be denied, neither can Palestine’s. The United States does not accept the legitimacy of continued Israeli settlements. This construction violates previous agreements and undermines efforts to achieve peace. It is time for these settlements to stop. Israel must also live up to its obligations to ensure that Palestinians can live, and work, and develop their society.”
There are things I didn't like about his speech, mostly not holding them to task for awful human rights violations, especially towards women and gays, but I did like the language above. Special interests will freak out and try to tear him down for his words on Israel, but I for one really liked him taking the political risk on it. A good balance between both the Israelis and Palestinians is what is needed, from my perspective. So long as he does the same to the Palestinians. We'll see.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:56 AM 
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This is exactly why I voted for him. We need a leader that can give a great speech and start getting the rest of the world to view us in a better light. The pen is indeed mightier than the sword. I thought the speech was a great start for discussions about that region and represented both sides well.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:28 PM 
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But is the world ready to stop giving Israel a free pass after WWII?


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:43 PM 
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Bovinity Divinity wrote:
But is the world ready to stop giving Israel a free pass after WWII?

Most of the world's leaders don't remember WWII, or its aftermath, so I'd say that's a yes.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:47 PM 
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Good times, then. Good times.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:53 PM 
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I'm just talking out my ass, by the way. I've no idea.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 2:52 PM 
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Joxur I know you don't care, but you win points from me for being open about this speech :). Maybe there's hope for you after all.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 2:57 PM 
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 Post subject: Obama's Cairo Speech
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:55 PM 
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I'm surprised no one has mentioned this yet. What did you think of it? What did you think of the reactions it got from around the world?

For those that missed it, it's here, but be warned it's nearly an hour long.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's Cairo Speech
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:14 PM 
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Actually, the "harder line on Israel" thread is referencing that speech.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's Cairo Speech
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:23 PM 
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I was able to catch part of it earlier, going to watch the rest later tonight. Seems like a fairly good speech overall though. I really got the impression and felt like he was "one of us" over there trying to make the case for us to a culture that has had far too much anti-Americanism ingrained. At the same time he appropriately made the point that both sides share some blame.

I appreciate his good speeches, I would like to see more action from him though. I'm hopeful that it will come with time, but it's hard to say at this point.


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 Post subject: Re: Obama's Cairo Speech
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:30 PM 
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Bleh. I'm completely distracted right now (packing for a move) so I completely forgot about that thread. Mods, merge?

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 Post subject: Re: Obama's Cairo Speech
PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 6:07 AM 
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Tyral the Kithless wrote:
Bleh. I'm completely distracted right now (packing for a move) so I completely forgot about that thread. Mods, merge?


Done.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:24 PM 
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Interesting series of reax from Israeli perspectives.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8085167.stm

So far my favorite is this one from an editorial in Ha'aretz

Quote:
It was not only before Islam and the West, but also, perhaps mostly, before Israel, the Palestinians and the Arabs that an opportunity for a new beginning was laid out in Cairo yesterday… The government of Israel, like that of the Palestinians, has no right to ignore this opportunity and place it in the drawer alongside all the other missed opportunities. The price of missing out will not be measured in the quality of relations with Washington, but in human lives.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:32 PM 
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Until some action is done, it is just another speech. Obama is good at making speeches. Let's see some positive action done.

I am not bashing the speech, he read it well. I am wondering if this will be another watch what I say and not what I do situation.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 12:58 PM 
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"He read it well." I realize most politicians don't have much of a hand in their own speechwriting, but it's a well-known fact that Obama writes a great deal of his speeches.

Otherwise, yes, agreed. It's a speech. Now let's see some action to back it up.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:15 PM 
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Tyral the Kithless wrote:
but it's a well-known fact that Obama writes a great deal of his speeches.


Huh?


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 1:20 PM 
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It got the impression that you thought that's all he did, was just read something someone else wrote.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 2:46 PM 
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"He read it well" certainly shows a lot of respect for Obama's intellect!


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 3:17 PM 
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joxur wrote:
reax

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 7:11 PM 
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Well, you didn't answer me the first time, Binkee, so now I'm gonna havta reax you da question.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 7:17 PM 
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Good one, heh.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 8:18 AM 
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Interesting thoughts from Camille Paglia on the speech.

http://www.salon.com/opinion/paglia/200 ... print.html


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:00 PM 
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If I had a nickel for every time someone has said "he missed the opportunity to talk about..." or "I wish he had spoken a little more on..." in regards to that speech, I'd be a rich man.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:21 PM 
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They almost number up there with the 'it's interesting what he didn't say...x, y, z' hogwash they keep spooling on NPR. Basically another way of saying the same thing.


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