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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:01 AM 
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The thing that gets me about that article is that I know I read it a long time ago.. looking for a date I found "Issue 11.09 | September 2003" not sure if that was the date or not... anyhoo, in the article they say:

Quote:
They are grown in a warehouse in Florida by a roomful of Russian-designed machines spitting out 3-carat roughs 24 hours a day, seven days a week. A second company, in Boston, has perfected a completely different process for making near-flawless diamonds and plans to begin marketing them by year's end. This sudden arrival of mass-produced gems threatens to alter the public's perception of diamonds - and to transform the $7 billion industry. More intriguing, it opens the door to the development of diamond-based semiconductors.


And I am all WTF where are all the diamonds??? It's been 4 years, there must be shitload made...


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 6:22 AM 
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http://www.apollodiamond.com/ - you can buy from this website, though they say they will be opening "soon", and in one area say 2007. Guess they are running out of time meeting that deadline. :)

Here is gemesis the other company:

http://www.gemesis.com/buy.aspx

And of course, there's the perennial favorite;
http://www.lifegem.com/

It doesn't say love unless you killed someone and used their body to make it. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:45 AM 
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monocot wrote:
http://www.apollodiamond.com/ - you can buy from this website, though they say they will be opening "soon", and in one area say 2007. Guess they are running out of time meeting that deadline. :)

Here is gemesis the other company:

http://www.gemesis.com/buy.aspx

And of course, there's the perennial favorite;
http://www.lifegem.com/

It doesn't say love unless you killed someone and used their body to make it. ;)

I poked around on some of the vendor sites for Gemesis and can't find pricing information, any idea what they sell for? They also seem to only offer fancy colors, has anyone seen mention of 'white' stones?

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:19 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 5:26 PM 
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God speed tomorrow Carolsue.. God-speed.. hope you make it through the day!

I feel for all people tomorrow working at the large retailers, people will be rude and forget about kindness at the holidays, religious or not.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 10:01 PM 
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http://www.miadonna.com/

Here's one I found that had prices.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 12:42 AM 
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Ah the lovely Black Friday... where I am up at 1:30 in the morning to go to work at 2:30. Hopefully I people are calm like they were last year at my Best Buy. Only two years ago we had two gianormous ladies fight over 2.99 dvds stacked on a table, only to have one of them fall on the table and have them spill all over the floor.

As far as synthetic-type near flawlesss diamonds... http://www.moissanite.com/ is pretty nice. Almost as hard as a diamond and refracts light better.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:08 AM 
I schooled the old school.
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People were lining up at the Best Buy near my house at 8pm last night :/


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:45 AM 
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My wife went this morning at 3am... Craziness. I slept in til 10. <3 having time off from work.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 4:32 PM 
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My 18th straight Black Friday working in retail. I think I have started work between 4-5 am every year except for 2 years... this one no exception.

I will say, however, that the people this year seemed to be a LOT friendlier than in years past. Actually lemme rephrase... they were not mean or rude or inconsiderate as they have been in year's past. Not sure why that is, because we did run out of quite a few of the key low price items we had advertised. But overall, people just came into the store and bought stuff and left without any arguments or tense situations.

I did have one woman, probably late 50's/early 60's, who complained that our sale said until Saturday, but we were out of the item. She said something to the effect of "Well your sign says on sale until Saturday, and that is not fair that you don't have the product." (it was for a TV that was like almost half off). I just looked at her and said "Well yes, the item is on sale until Saturday. However, we had over 4000 people enter our store before you... including nearly 1000 people in the first 30 minutes of our opening, and we sold the item out in about 15 minutes. We could have had 1000 of those TV's in our store and we would not have had enough for the Phoenix metro area. It is a good deal, you came five hours after we opened, we are out of it. Sorry." I think she was just more frustrated with herself that she overslept and missed out on the deals :(

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 4:47 PM 
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What is your position after 18 years of working retail, I wonder? Do you manage a few stores in PHX or something?


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 6:24 PM 
I schooled the old school.
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I imagine it's the director of "none of your business," since I have a feeling you are looking for a way to belittle Cicely based on whatever answer is given.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:31 PM 
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Nope, just kinda curious. I live in PHX and I was just wondering what someone would be doing after 18yrs. I doubt he's a stocker in the back. =P


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:34 PM 
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I believe he's stated more then a few times he's in a management position.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:43 PM 
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I wouldnt mine being a manager in a Best Buy.. Hell id probably be great at it. hah!

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:33 PM 
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I work at target, in the logistics (i unload the truck, then stock shelfs/backstock).

I been at it 7 months, holy shit... talk about hard physical work for crap ass pay. I heard the pay is better once they know you are sticking around. 18 years... damn, thats impressive right there. In my store, even the store manager takes weekends where they have to run the trucks (those are my favorite weekends, they havent a clue). I give Cic a ton of credit- no matter where in the chain you are at, thats a ton of bullshit to deal with all the time.

I do agree about the pleasantness of people- very laid back and kind today.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:51 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:36 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:10 PM 
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Not to be off topic what are those pictures called?

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:13 PM 
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My wife is a regional manager for a big fast food chain (works 5 stores.) out here so I can sympathize with people workin' in the trenches. Just cuz it's retail or food doesn't mean the upper level positions can't be very hard work. Shrug.

I give props to Cicely too, cuz you deal with the lowest common denominator of asshole people daily in retail... it must be maddening.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:18 PM 
Cazic Thule owned RoA
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Motivationals, Cak.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:32 AM 
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I bought a lexmark x3430 at walmart for 25 bucks.. its a copier, printer, scanner. We were there grocery shopping tonight and seen them. I have been needing a new printer for awhile(and my wife has been riding my ass to buy a scanner), and couldn't beat the price.

The store was pretty crowded at 8pm... lots of people still out bargain hunting. We ended up not going out at all =).

anyhooo, i have never had a scanner before, so tonight I am putting my pictures on my computer. For your enjoyment, Draagun's very first christmas:

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:09 AM 
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That guy in the background looks like the bad guy from Grease.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:14 AM 
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thats my dad.. and he wasthe bad guy in grease =/


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:51 AM 
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I too had red overalls as a baby. But were yours OshKosh B'Gosh?!


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 3:28 PM 
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You were super happy, where's that smile now!


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:54 PM 
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What I bought on Black Friday

5 Express Dress shirts for 20$ a piece
1 320gig 3.0gb sata hard drive at best buy for 60$

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:38 PM 
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Quote:
Plastics and cubic zirconia are not diamonds, the properties are markedly different so try again, better yet, don't.


I don't think anyone commented on this one yet. But the properties in question here, clarity, cut etc are in fact pretty damn close to identical. So for this argument you're wrong. Now if we were arguing the merits of using diamonds in drilling or something else you might have a point....

Don't get me wrong, I've bought diamonds before and would again. But never for myself, and the difference is I recognize the worthlessness of it.

Quote:
I'm certainly not kept awake at night, fearful that my stone will plummet in 'value' due to some rogue business flooding the market with them.


Why would you? It plummeted in value the day you bought it. As soon as it leaves the store it's basically worthless.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:40 PM 
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Rileigh wrote:
I don't think anyone commented on this one yet. But the properties in question here, clarity, cut etc are in fact pretty damn close to identical. So for this argument you're wrong. Now if we were arguing the merits of using diamonds in drilling or something else you might have a point....

It's irrelevant that some properties are close ('cut' isn't a property either by the way) when other properties are again, markedly different; the argument you're supporting is no different than claiming glass and plastic are the exact same thing because they have some commonalities. And just so we're clear, my argument is that diamonds are different from cubic zirconia and plastic, period, no qualifiers.

Rileigh wrote:
Why would you? It plummeted in value the day you bought it. As soon as it leaves the store it's basically worthless.
I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, that said, I wouldn't be so quick as to assume I made the same mistakes.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:46 PM 
Oh yeah? How 'bout I kick your ass?
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Draguun, is that a sybian?

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:32 PM 
Cazic Thule owned RoA
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hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:51 PM 
For the old school!
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:45 AM 
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Quote:
Draguun, is that a sybian?

No, better. That my friend is a big ass dog shaped toy box. I had that toybox till I - well, stopped playing with toys. It was awesome - it also doubled as a plane, submarine, bed, house, wrestling partner, horse, motorcycle, imaginary pet - you name it =) Probably one of the best gifts ever.

You know how people always say "we should just get them a box, they like that more than the present" - well, get your kids a big ass dog shaped toy box - you can't go wrong.


as a side note... I noticed the ominous 666 too... I just think its funny how it stuck out. I mean, how often do you really notice somebodies post count?


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:12 AM 
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Quote:
I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, that said, I wouldn't be so quick as to assume I made the same mistakes.


The resale value of diamonds is next to nothing. The setting is more valuable than the diamond itself.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:46 AM 
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Vanamar wrote:
Quote:
I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, that said, I wouldn't be so quick as to assume I made the same mistakes.


The resale value of diamonds is next to nothing. The setting is more valuable than the diamond itself.

Which is what happens when you buy a garbage diamond that's only been 'appraised' rather than actually certified.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:21 AM 
The Lurker at the Threshold

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Quote:
Which is what happens when you buy a garbage diamond that's only been 'appraised' rather than actually certified.


right. keep thinking that, chief.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 10:28 AM 
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:07 AM 
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Argrax wrote:
It's irrelevant that some properties are close ('cut' isn't a property either by the way) when other properties are again, markedly different; the argument you're supporting is no different than claiming glass and plastic are the exact same thing because they have some commonalities. And just so we're clear, my argument is that diamonds are different from cubic zirconia and plastic, period, no qualifiers.


Great, yeah I don't think anyone here is arguing that diamonds are IDENTICAL in every way. They're (we're) saying that for the purpose that a piece of jewelry serves the properties, attributes, etc of synthetic/fake diamonds serve just as well.

Quote:
I'm sorry to hear that happened to you, that said, I wouldn't be so quick as to assume I made the same mistakes.


The only diamond I ever bought came completely with certificate and all that other neat paperwork. It's still worthless (and not just because the relationship is worthless now as well! haha). I heard that you and Amanda got engaged, congratulations. :) :) Diamond is a necessary evil, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a stupid necessary evil. haha

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:17 AM 
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Vanamar wrote:
Quote:
Which is what happens when you buy a garbage diamond that's only been 'appraised' rather than actually certified.


right. keep thinking that, chief.

While I understand that many forum members are veritable diamond experts thanks to having read an article or two on the interweb, and though I appreciate their insight, I can assure you that after having done the volume of research that I did over the course of severeal months, I'm quite comfortable (and happy) with the end result.

Am I the normal, ordinary consumer? Absolutely not. Would I be able to sell my stone back for what I paid for it? No. If I were in some dire financial needand had to sell it off, would I have lost thousands of dollars? Hardly.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:19 AM 
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You just got engaged? No wonder you're throwing a fit. I knew you just bought a worthless piece of rock!

SUCKER!


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:29 AM 
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Rileigh wrote:
Great, yeah I don't think anyone here is arguing that diamonds are IDENTICAL in every way. They're (we're) saying that for the purpose that a piece of jewelry serves the properties, attributes, etc of synthetic/fake diamonds serve just as well.
That's just it, they were.

Rileigh wrote:
The only diamond I ever bought came completely with certificate and all that other neat paperwork.

Who was it certified by? Did it come with a plot plan and/or laser inscription? What were the attributes?

Rileigh wrote:
I heard that you and Amanda got engaged, congratulations. :) :)

Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 11:48 AM 
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I heard that you and Amanda got engaged, congratulations

things just started to make a whole lot more sense


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:07 PM 
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http://cgi.ebay.com/AUTHENTIC-DIAMOND-D ... dZViewItem


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:11 PM 
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DraagunSoulstealer wrote:
things just started to make a whole lot more sense

Apparently you guys missed an earlier comment that I made...
Argrax wrote:
...it doesn't reduce the 'fire' of my own stone.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:18 PM 
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I think the point is this.

If you walked into a jewelry store and purchased a diamond this instant, then walked through the revolving doors to sell it back to them in a time span of 10 seconds, the value of said diamond has already went down 90% or more.

I look at the certification being nothing more than a statement of what carrot, color and cut I purchased, and nothing to do with retaining value. I honestly could care less. The value to me was in the meaning in which it was given.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:22 PM 
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Yeah. Why not just give them a cubic zirconia and call it a day? Still has the same meaning. You just paid hundres (thousands) less. =)


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:24 PM 
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Argrax wrote:
Rileigh wrote:
Great, yeah I don't think anyone here is arguing that diamonds are IDENTICAL in every way. They're (we're) saying that for the purpose that a piece of jewelry serves the properties, attributes, etc of synthetic/fake diamonds serve just as well.
That's just it, they were.


I didn't really get that from reading the discussion, shrug.

Quote:
Who was it certified by? Did it come with a plot plan and/or laser inscription? What were the attributes?


No clue, Kat still has it along with the paper work. haha

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:27 PM 
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xskycrasherx wrote:
Yeah. Why not just give them a cubic zirconia and call it a day? Still has the same meaning. You just paid hundres (thousands) less. =)


Because girls like to feel appreciated. Apparently that means spending 2-3months salary on an object as a pledge of your affection. :violent1:

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:30 PM 
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no shit.. and if you have a dieing need to throw away that much money - buy a cubiczirconia or wtf ever and give the 10 grand to a charity or just fucking burn it in front of the chick to show your sacrifice.

I think I'm done smashing my head into the brickwall that is this thread. Diamonds are fucking stupid, you don't get it and probably never will - much like 90% of the general public. Enjoy your rock. I'm going to pass a kidney stone and make a ring out of that for my woman.... now that's fucking love.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:54 PM 
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Givin Wetwillies wrote:
I look at the certification being nothing more than a statement of what carrot, color and cut I purchased, and nothing to do with retaining value. I honestly could care less. The value to me was in the meaning in which it was given.

Not quite true Givin, different labs have different standards. When you buy a stone certified by AGS or GIA you know you're getting exactly what's printed on the paper (plus or minus half a grade); not to mention a plot plan provides you with a 'fingerprint' for your stone which is some measure of protection for the consumer (as is laser insciption).

Whereas a stone certified by lesser labs, and even worse than that, simply appraised by the jewelery store leaves the consumer with a stone that's supposedly SI1 clarity and F color when in reality it's an I2 clarity and H-I color.

So not only are you paying the huge jewelery store markups but you're not even getting what you're paying for. Rightfully you should pay X for Y but end up paying 2x for 2/3y or three times as much as you should have, which unfortunately is commonplace.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 12:56 PM 
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Cut the bullshit and just admit that diamonds are arbitrarily valued and hyped. There is no demand for them except for the ones that the companies schlepping them create. I'm so tired of this thread.

This is my last post in it. :spam1: :blob4:


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:45 PM 
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Quote:
Because girls like to feel appreciated. Apparently that means spending 2-3months salary on an object as a pledge of your affection.


Fuck that form of appreciation, use it for something useful, like a down payment on a house or something that's actually going to maybe keep its value. Rather then just something to *look* for a little while that really doesn't have any other use.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:01 PM 
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Here's an article I came across that touches on the importance of a quality stone (and certificate) if you're interested in resale value; it also mentions the reduced influence DeBeers has on the market versus decades past. The article isn't exactly current but I thought it still had some value.

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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:59 PM 
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DraagunSoulstealer wrote:
Quote:
I heard that you and Amanda got engaged, congratulations

things just started to make a whole lot more sense

Heh, it's been pretty obvious to me from the vehemence of Agrax's denial that he either worked in the diamond industry or recently popped for one.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:00 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:12 PM 
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Just for the sake of contributing something halfway constructive to the thread:

People buy diamonds for the same reason they generally don't go to work in their bathrobes: social norms. It just so happens that this particular social norm has been cleverly constructed over the years by a few canny marketeers in order to line their bankbooks, which is why I take issue with it.

The last jewelry I gave a girl was a simple gold ring I made myself. It didn't cost much - just the price of the metal and the hours I invested in shaping, polishing, and engraving it. But like Givin said, the value of this stuff is largely symbolic - and as a symbol, I'm of the opinion that a handmade piece is more valuable than any diamond you could buy.


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 10:33 AM 
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http://www.azcentral.com/business/artic ... s0116.html


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 10:50 AM 
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nice


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 Post subject: Re: Black Friday
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 2:05 PM 
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I'm really late coming to this one, but since it's back up, I'll join in.

Diamonds are rare relative to other decorative stones. Rarity and availability are two different things, and diamonds are a highly available rare resource. The ability to go into a store and buy one 24/7 is a function of the availability, not the rarity. SuperBowl tickets would be the other extreme, of something that is not rare, but has very low availability. Both extremes affect price and value.

Diamond prices are inflated and worth much less the minute you walk out the door with it. That is true of all jewelry though, and is simple to explain. You are paying for the store, the people working there, the people who made the setting, etc. All of these people are there for a reason, and that reason is not for a fun hobby. This dynamic is true in all retail settings, including your TV, computer, cars....well, everything. The amount your purchase loses in value is directly proportional to the volume of sales that industry makes. If the overhead costs are spread out over a large number of sales, the reduced product value will be much less than an industry that has a relatively low volume. This is why all jewelry is marked up so high over cost (a low volume industry), otherwise the store wouldn't make a reasonable profit and would just sell iPods instead. With all that said, it doesn't mean diamonds are a fools purchase anymore than any other "eye candy" item would be, since that price if figured in when you buy it. At a movie theater the value of your ticket goes from $6 to $0 in just 2 hours. Even with that %100 consumer net value loss, the industry survives.

Keeping the supply in check is also a common dynamic in every natural resource industry, not just diamonds. The existance of OPEC does not make oil worthless. Of course oil is a functional resource as opposed to a decorative one, but the relation still holds true for the example. At one point the US government regulated the volume of gold in the world (back when our money was actually backed by the gold standard). Limiting supply is not inherently an evil scheme, but simply a business decision to help maintain a consistent demand at a certain price. For a retail example, card games like Pokemon have used this tactic recently to drive the value up of their own product. Some cards are printed less often than others making these more valueable to the kids that want them. The cards do not cost any more to produce, nor do they serve any primary life function (food, shelter, clothing), and yet there is definately a difference in value among the cards produced. That is also an example of something that would hold value for some, and no value for others, such as those who don't play the game.


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