http://stcharlesjournal.stltoday.com/ne ... _1.ii1.txt

That's just one of the most fucked up and disturbing things I've read in awhile.

To summarize the article, essentially some adults decided to make a fake MySpace account to lure in a 13 year old child. The intention apparently was to use this phony account to lure the child into talking about things that she would not normally talk about. The adults wanted to know what this 13 year old really thought about their child (purportedly), about them, etc.

The family in question apparently used to vacation with the 13 year old girl's family and were once close. However the 13 year old (Megan) and their child had normal up and down kid drama where it was an on/off friendship.

Oh one other thing...Megan was on medication for depression and had been seeing a therapist since 3rd grade because in 3rd grade she talked about suicide. The other family knew this.

And things got dark and ugly when the cute boy account the adults made viciously turned on Megan, saying evil vile nasty things, which culminated into essentially telling this kid to go kill herself.

And she did.

------------

Obviously there's more to it than that, and probably various sides to it, but it's just really horrible. I remember those years quite well and everything was a Big Fucking Deal and drama like that would have felt like the end of the world. And it entered into the real world when it wasn't just the fake account, but it using IRL information to let her know it was people in her life who all hated her, thought she was a slut, a bad person, etc. They used the name of her town, and the name of her street, and apparently some other accounts joined in on bashing her.

Anyway it made me sick to my stomach. Especially when adults use such subterfuge to immerse themselves into the affairs of children. I can understand in one respect wanting to protect your child, and being concerned and wanting to do something when you see your kid hurt from the on/off friendship stuff that was probably going on. On the other hand...that's how children learn to deal with life. Parents should lend emotional support, should intervene by talking with the other parents when necessary, interfere further by placing limits on their own children...if necessary. Escalating through involving the school, if necessary. But this was typical teenage girl drama. The type where the kids will come home sobbing on a Monday and by Thursday be BBF once again. I wouldn't be that age again for all the money in the world heh.

I just can't imagine what possessed a parent to do something like that to a child, and what message that sent to their kid to know they were doing it. And then for other kids to know about it as well which is hinted at in the article. And they claim they lost control of the account so that the horrific messages which Megan got prior to her suicide didn't come from them.

I thought two things were really disturbing beyond that though. The first was a statement from the mother who was involved in setting up the fake account. She said she didn't feel bad about Megan's suicide anymore because she heard it wasn't Megan's first attempt. That's untrue, it was her first attempt, she was seeing a therapist since the 3rd grade due to depression and having talked about suicide once (she never attempted it). Those problems she had with depression this other family knew because they had taken Megan on family vacations (according to Megan's family).

Second was the claim that the media should be careful what it said, because the police reports had been changed by them because Megan's family had given false information. The police stated that the Fake MySpace family had never contacted them over the reports. In other words, they were lying.

----------

Ultimately this begs the question of accountability. I'm a child of the 80s and I recall all too well the lawsuits which occurred when teens killed themselves purportedly over Ozzy Osbourne music and the like. So generally speaking I'm predisposed to placing ALL accountability on those who take the action. Or to say that if something like that pushed them over the edge, odds are it would have been something else.

I'm not so sure about that here. Children feel intense emotions at that age. I remember about the same age as her coming home devistated (and I mean DEVISTATED) at some minor betrayal of a friend. I remember crying so hard I had that gasping breathing. And I think before the end of the week we were best friends again. I mean I remember feeling like shit was the END OF THE WORLD one day, to the point of trying to imagine how one would go on...to being the best day ever just a few days later. Emo-coaster FTW. Now fortunately for me every week wasn't like this, and my drama levels were probably lower in some respects than other teens (or maybe I just hope they were ;D).

Could someone have pushed me over the edge? I honestly don't know. But I know that adults were 'smarter' about such things that I was. I can look back now on most of these petty little dramas and see quite clearly what was what...whereas at the time it was a mystery to me. Why was soandso being MEAN! Mystery then, obvious now. If you placed an adult in these situations, especially one who's very saavy at social manipulation (which frankly I'm not) and kids are easy to manipulate I'm sure.

A 13 year old pitted against other 13 year olds is hard enough. Adults in the mix should be the voice of sanity, not the whackjob egging them on and finding new and inventive ways of fucking them over.

Anyway, I think based on what little is revealed in the article, that the adults involved do bear some accountability.

But there's another question: What of the law? Should such behavior be illegal? Honestly, I'm not a fan of adults doing shit like this to other adults. And there have been cases with lethal results there as well (there's a really fucked up case where a 40/50 year old man was pretending to be a 20 year old solider who was having a cyberaffair with a teenage girl, who was really in her 40s too, and the guy killed another 'suitor' over it who was local to him out of jealousy...fucked up shit for $1,000 Alex) but I don't know that it necessarily requires some type of law to protect adults.

But kids? I'm more inclined towards that. I'm not convinced, but I'm more inclined towards it.

_________________

Which is exactly why adult/child sex is illegal. The average thirteen year old does not in anyway have the emotional or mental ability to take on the average adult who is out to manipulate them. I would agree 100% that (assuming the story is accurate and their aren't any unknown mitigating circumstances), the people who played this little game are absolutely guilty of contributing to her death.

myspace is to blame, definitely. Deleting my account today.

I don't think anyone could deny this is a seriously fucked up set of human beings, but it did lead me to another train of thought.
Often either on the Lanys server or these boards, there have been people who are the target of derision and harrassment, due to shitlist behaviour or social ineptitude. People like Wenuvil or Xianle come to mind. Because this is an online forum, we have no way (usually) of knowing the age or mental state of the people we talk to. So if someone were driven to suicide off of comments made in game or on the message boards, what would be the point of culpability? I guess I mean where is the point that this particular couple jumped the shark?

Is it due to the vast age difference of the couple and the child, the intimate personal knowledge they had to mess her up mentally or the pattern of harrassment itself? Or do you think this is something similar to obscenity laws, where it's not easily quantifiable, but you'll know it when you see it?

That's actually an interesting point. We've definately said some pretty shitty things on this board to kids ourselves. huh

Sometimes, we say things online to people that we would NEVER in a million years say to somebody face to face. I know I have been pretty hard on some people online, not just on these boards, but on my own DOD server. One of the things I am working on is tact with my members. For example, we have 3 guys in our clan right now that just drive me up the wall... I mean seriously make me want to kick them out and ban them from our server. We use voice chat and maybe that's one reason it's so much harder to tie into somebody online there.

I want these guys to change their attitudes in game, they are admins and long standing members of the clan, but they really bring the server down everytime they log on. I am the law there, but I just can't bring myself to tell them to goto hell. If it were a typing only situation, I would have no problem at all telling them to hit the bricks. As an officer in TSO way back in the day, I kicked a few people out of the guild for not having the "TSO spirit". It was a fuck of a lot easier when I didn't have to talk to them for real.

I've forgotten my point. I guess that the anonymity of the internet can really bring out a bad side in people. duh though, right?

heh i was playing DOD tonight and guess I just needed to vent a bit

TOTALLY off topic, but what's DOD, just curious.

As far as the mental state of some people on Lanys, there were a few people that (obviously IMO only) were mentally ill that I had to deal with as an admin. If I believed there was something wrong, and I mean really something wrong not just 'what in the fuck is wrong with you people', I'd urge them to get help. And I'd try to do so in a way that didn't come off poorly. Because it really can come off poorly, like an attempt to 'own' them by suggesting they are ill, or a means to belittle them. I'd always try to be compassionate to people because you don't know what's going on on the other end of a computer. You don't know who just had their spouse leave them. Or who lost a job and is struggling. We don't know people's issues that they might be dealing with that shades their behavior, and that's something I try to remember whenever I see someone acting like a dick (or in a manner I think they're being a dick).

That being said, I'm human and not a saint by a long shot. And there's times when I've had shit going on and I've probably (no...certainly) taken it out on other people. But I've tried to be an adult about it and make amends when necessary, etc. I try not to be an asshole. But again, human...far from perfect (really really far, but I'm working on it ).

One of the things I liked about Lanys was a certain amount of accountability, which helped to some degree to keep behavior in check. Unfortunately the social dynamic also allowed for some things to go on that...well I think are a shame that people felt the need to do to themselves or others. I'm really not trying to come off at all 'holier than thou' or anything, but some of the shit people did, I'll never 'get'. Oh well. But for the most part, I think we had a decent community. Actually more than 'decent' of course. I never liked the bullshit between guilds, but I had more than a few people tell me they did like it and found that type of stuff fun. I didn't.

But outside of a few incidents I can think of offhand, and very few...I don't think people around here were too mean. Maybe I'm bullshitting myself with only happy memories or something (though more than a few times I was about ready to pull out all my hair with stupid weenie bullshit I had to admin) but really...by and large people were very good people in this community.

For every public owning, which was really IMO about taking an asshat to task which (sometimes) bandwagoned into a six page thread, there were people who perhaps not so publically helped people out pretty substantially. People who helped others on Lanys find jobs. People who offered people on Lanys shelter. More than one person on this board has ensured that someone's kids had a Christmas. People who've sent e-mails to others which were nothing more than a reaching out of, 'Hey...I care'.

No posts about it. No public acknowledgements, and none ever wanted. But I'm willing to bet every one of you knows of incidents like that, and for each we know, there are I'm sure many dozens of others we don't.

Ah, maybe I'm still a little too protective of Lanys, but this has been, and still is, an incredible community. And that's because of the people in it.

Which isn't to say we can't all be reminded to maybe be a little kinder, a little more patient, a little less self absorbed when dealing with others, since we don't have all the information on their lives, or what they might be dealing with. I know I need to really keep that in mind myself when playing World of Warcraft when I taunt morons simply because I can, and it amuses me. I'm not doing it to hurt anyone, and I don't say anything hateful...but that's just rationalization because it's still amusing myself sometimes at the expense of others. It's probably much easier in WoW because of the lack of 'community' and the lack of really feeling like you know many people behind the characters, beyond those you actually spend time with (or Vent with).

At the end of the day, I'd have to say the majority of people, even one's who've acted dickishly...most of them never did so to do intentional harm.

Back on topic with the MySpace shit, read the article and tell me if (assuming it's all accurate) those people didn't intend to harm. I don't think adults could say and do those things to a 13 year old without specifically intending to inflict pain...you just can't.

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DOD is Day of Defeat. It is a semi-popular modification for Half-Life/Source. It is a multiplayer-only, team-based, World War II shooter that is not worth playing. Apart from having totally generic and uninventive gameplay it is remarkable for its repugnant population of annoying high school kids and overly serious dudes who refuse to admit it is just a game.

The only appealing feature of the game is how fun and easy it is to kill your teammates. A lot of the spawn points lead to a choke point and you can totally destroy your team by standing in a doorway and dropping a single grenade. After you do this for like an hour and are banned from every active server you can say you truly had all that DOD has to offer.

You can also kill people with shovels.

In relation to the actual topic, I don't think it was the bad parents that drove the girl to kill herself. Her ex-friend and the other neighborhood girl seemed to be the ones that blew the whole thing up and sent the negative messages. I don't find that all that surprising, since kids are really good and being mean and cruel to eachother. The problem is that the bad parents enabled the situation by creating a ruse that was much more powerful and devious than anything a teenager could have thought up.

It's impossible to hold the bad parents accountable under the law, but I would imagine that the death they caused won't slide easily from their minds. It's really just a terrible situation no matter which side you are on.

[iimg]http://fi.somethingawful.com/customtitles/title-hawaiian_shirt-2.gif[/img]

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You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.You cannot make another post so soon after your last.

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<iimg src="http://www.oryxguild.com/signatures/oryx_binkpee.gif">

_____________________________________________________________

DOD is Day of Defeat. It is a semi-popular modification for Half-Life/Source. It is a multiplayer-only, team-based, World War II shooter that is not worth playing. Apart from having totally generic and uninventive gameplay it is remarkable for its repugnant population of annoying high school kids and overly serious dudes who refuse to admit it is just a game.

The only appealing feature of the game is how fun and easy it is to kill your teammates. A lot of the spawn points lead to a choke point and you can totally destroy your team by standing in a doorway and dropping a single grenade. After you do this for like an hour and are banned from every active server you can say you truly had all that DOD has to offer.

You can also kill people with shovels.

That's pretty close. It really isn't even semi-popular anymore. It has been around for a very VERY long time and 95% of the servers today are filled with bots. I stay with it because 1. I am good at it 2. It is slower than most FPSs . As for the kids, there are a LOT that play. We no longer accept people under the age of 18 in our clan. We did have a jr. division, but most of them left under a shitstorm of drama about 7 months back. Good riddance I say.

I can understand your frustration with the game droma... you have to remember each round is only as good as the map you are on. I also happen to be a mapper for day of defeat. I also convert HL and CS maps over to day of defeat too. I can tell you, some maps will make you want to fucking slice your fingers off, while others will make you fizz your shit with glee.

Your post brought a tear to my eye Tarot!

Well not literally, but it was touching. I'm so emo!

_________________
-Rileigh (aka Golliwog)

Great. I stumbled upon a thread at ANOTHER PLACE where a few pedo apologists started a thread with the usual apologetics that such Cunts make. They were blasted, particularly by victims, my point is it was a mistake to click on the thread.

Now I read this thread.

I think I am going to pound something.

Anyways, very disgusting.

--J.D.

What the fuck are you even talking about?

_________________
Marauder Harabakc Goat

Go pound sand. You still aren't welcome around here.

So if we apology for pedos a lot then we can make him go away? I'm nopt too sure how do that, but it might be worth something.

the joke here is that you're an idiot

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Well guys I want to apologize for pedos. they are kind of sick but in the world we live in today it is kind of understandable.

I just think that you put all the blame on pedos, you got to look at the feet too. They kind of have it coming when they are wearing all kinds of provocative stuff like, for example: thongs, tight leather, low cut tops that show too much ankle. That's their decision to look like that, so when they get what's coming to them, they kind of deserve it. It's their own fault.

Look at this disgusting picture that is symbol of pedo everywhere, :



yeah, if you don't know what that latin means I will tell you. It means "zeal for the feat." fucked up world we live in now.

I still think whichever university allowed DoctorX to receive any kind of academic credentials should revoke them immediately. What kind of twerp that deems himself academically superior gets beat senseless by gamers on an EverQuest message board? Please go memorize a few more religious texts and claim to be educated, thank you. Obviously one difficult field to be in. You're worthless.

(Not to denigrate any educated Lanysites, because we have some intelligent people here, but we are not the first shop to stop at)

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he went to the same school as dr. mario and master p

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I think you're all missing the point, he's calling Tarot a cunt. That's what's most important here.

No he's not he says the CUNTS <--[bold] are at AMNOTHER PLACE. Which means not here in the realm of Lanys Multi-community Forums. Get a clue Skycrasher.

He didn't say that "such cunts" were specific to the other forum, quite the opposite, he indicated that these are the types of threads that "such cunts" post, regardless of what forum they're posted on.

PWNED

You might want to stop patting yourself on the back for making yourself look retarded, Skycrasher.

_________________

Making myself look stupid? Take a gander at your avatar, bud.

Yes, because insulting Nick Frost (as if it matters to me) is the sort of response I would have expected from someone who has just realized he totally misread a post, went on to make a bigger ass of himself when it was pointed out, and is now looking for some way to save face and duck out of the thread with his tail between his legs.

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I still think I'm right about the way I read the post. He clearly indicates that threads like these are started by cunts. If he said "they were posted in by cunts" it would be different.

L2Read

I /gkicked skycrasher for being a loot whore, because he was one. WASSUP NOW SUCKA

I was gkicked cuz they gave you all the loot you couldn't get in FL and I called you on it. Ha. We killed Vindi or somethin and your brother defaulted the BP to you. Ghey. =(

brackets mine. Learn to follow "where", "with", and "that" in a sentence.

Followed by



So, any intelligent reader can tell that he was on another message board where he encountered a thread inhabited by what he calls Pedo Apologists and then came here and read this unrelated thread and was angry at the world/whatever for the creepy people it contains.

Really, Sky. It is beyond sad now. It's ok to just admit you were wrong.

_________________

I thought I was right I wasn't trolling the thread. Why the fuck would he post that here then? It has no relevance to this thread. Who gives a shit?

You don't have to be such a fucking prick about it man. Jesus Christ. You love to lace into me at the slightest chance you have.

*blink*

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well i mean sometimes they're totally asking for it

_________________

Pretty sure it was over some crappy weapon off a random giant you were screaming about. I got my vindi bp after Lannarie.

They got Megan's mother to call in to an afternoon radio show in Seattle yesterday and recount the whole story. She was really irritating. I think I would have killed myself if I had to live with her too.


Seriously though, I think it's a bit different to call a stranger over the net a douche on some boards that you both read, then to maliciously persecute a kid 3 houses down your street. When she was first telling the story, I was thinking "well, it's kids, and kids do some pretty fucked up things. It's really no different from an average high school.. this is just the first time I've heard of this story with an Myspace twist." Then I heard it was the parents of the other girl who were doing it, and that struck me as pretty reprehensible.

The really shitty thing, to me, is that the family that went out of their way to act like nothing happened. They invited the grieving parents to their daughters birthday party, over for dinner... etc. They even asked them to store a fooseball table that they bought their kids for Christmas. I guess when Megan's parents found out who was responsible, they smashed the table... heh, I would have skipped the table and beat some ass.

Wait ... is there really an EQ loot discussion happening on these boards?

Wait ... and Skycrasher the "If you play MMO's today you have no life" guy is at the core of discussing it?

... is there an smiley or poster for such a thing? I think I know how Cartman felt when he broke his funny bone in the episode of people with asses for faces.

_________________

First, he brought it up, second, when did I say if you play MMOs you have no life? I play WoW. What are you talking about?

I'M FUCKING CONFUSED NOW

Stop painting big red targets all over your chest and maybe you won't get shot down so much.

Each time I've done it, I've given you the opportunity to back down from your stupidity. Instead, you chose to ignore me and paint a bigger target, and who am I to argue with that?

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who would have thuoght a thread about myspace would become such a crock of shit

(i did)

you guys are dumb you should all die

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wotwot.bmp

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Who is calling Tarot a "cunt?"

--J.D.

Huk huk. Its just like the blizzard forums, only less funny. I didn't even think that was possible.

Stupid cunt.

Who wants a mustache ride?

ps...Tom Selleck ftw

_________________

anything that anyone says is ftw is pretty much completely robbed of any ability to be ftw

_________________

binkee ftw

lmao pwned

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Looks like the state where this occurred is designing a law against online harrassment because of this case.

I can see it now, depending on how the law is written.... Watch out you board bullies! Ima gonna sue!! ><

Heh sorry didn't realize you couldn't edit in rants...last post.

A small update I guess

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071203/ap_on_re_us/internet_suicide

Better start watching what we say to each other on the boards. Here come the internet lawsuit threats again.

They can send the summons to Givin of the Internet.

Who hates you.