**Beta 5 has started**

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Hey all, as of about 2 minutes ago, Beta 5 has started. Its not "completely" open per se quite yet though, we're going to be staggering the new testers coming in today, and then opening it up. We'll be sending out a press notice in a few minutes here too, and I will post that here when its out.

Anyway, what that means, is that the NDA is as of right now, lifted.

Have fun, all.
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Nick Parkinson
Community Manager
Sigil Games Online
"Where are my pants?"

Hmm I have tons of screenshots but no way of hosting them so I can't include them but if anyone wants to know stuff about VG there are alot of us in Beta that would be glad to answer.

Some things that can't be answered and will in a way make the current state of the game apparent. The Dreadknight revamp went live yesterday, so the balancing of the class is just starting. Many classes still have revamps coming, so there is really not alot final to be said about the classes that haven't had it yet. I used to play a Psionist as my main but the class is pretty fubar right now and I know others that can post a lot more on the state of things for them anyhow.

Some have. I can answer questions about those classes. My main these days is a Goblin Monk Dragon style and I love it. Never thought I would like a DPS melee class but I do. Monks choose a form at level 15, Harmonious, Dragon, or Drunken. Each has specific strengths and weaknesses. Drunken is supposed to be evasive and a counterattacker for instance. The dragon style makes it pretty close to a EQ style monk, with feign death, pretty good dps, and a bunch of effects that help other classes with their abilities as well. One thing about combat in VG, if the people you are playing with know how to play and you work together, you can up your efficiency a lot... a whole lot.

Combat is really simple to learn but very hard to master. Again the issue is though, not every part of the combat sphere is live yet and not all classes are finished. Also not everyone is interested in learning to play well. Being in a guild with non asshats will be a good thing.

The World. Very large and very detailed. Lots of static mobs that look kinda stupid just standing around. Plus they don't actually pop into view until you are right on top of them. Really annoying. The openness of the world is great for screenshots (along with the draw distance) but not so great when you are traveling the same road for the 30th time.

Dungeons in VG are handcrafted and really good. Some are huge. In Beta most had walls that were blocked with rocks which later of crafters will be able to remove opening new areas we haven't seen yet.

Each of the starting areas has a distinct flavor. If you actually read the quest text given as you progress you will learn quickly what is going on in your area. There are fairly linear quest lines from 1-12 in most starter areas. For instance, the Goblin area has you start out as an escaping slave. Your first quests have you help the others that escaping in various ways. After you complete the entry line quests others follow that lead you out of the starter area.

To play the game smoothly you really need a sorta current computer. I would say the one I use is a bare minimum, unless optimization in the last few weeks really makes huge strides. I play on a 3700+ with 2 gigs of ram and a 7800gt oc video card. I play on High settings. I only turn off volumetric clouds and decrease shadows. Usually this gets me about 25-30 fps. Yes, I intend to get a better video card and cpu in the next 2 weeks. People with newer systems will see a much better game than those without.

More later unless others answer all other questions.

ps Bloodmages are healers done right
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fixed it -Tarot

Well, I can't get pictures to work.

You gotta post the code right... You cant post the PHP for caks site, you gotta llink directly to the jpg.

Also, I didnt know Guurn was a Sigil-ite too... Very interesting.

Well then, howcome i never got my beta invite?! j/k

Also its nice to see the NDA lifted... Kinda concerned about open beta though honestly. For some reason i forsee a 'rushed' sensation for the open beta --> release. But that would be nothing new for any MMO lately.

Great they invite more people when the server are already crashing all the time due to too many people playing.

This game suck so much threads by the 1000's on the way unless they seriously upgrade the bandwith and processing power of the servers...

those look like amazing pics. i really liked the one with the squid/octopus coming out of the water. really impressive.

i remember wanting to play vanguard, ever since i met the guys at e3 in 2005. i guess it is time to build/buy a new computer possibly... although i don't have that mmorpg itch like i used to, vanguard just looks and feels really good.

without, of course, all the problems once they ever get fixed

-cc

I'll write my more extensive review later tonight, untill then i'll just say this.

Six months or so from now, this will be the most amazing mmo experience you could ever have since Everquest 1. That is, if you bring your own permagroup with you.

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Looks like pure crap.

/goes back to waiting for Age of Conan

/twitches

For all its faults, it most certainly does not look like crap.

Now if you were saying that his UI looks like complete and total shit, you'd be dead on.

I've been waiting for this stupid NDA to drop. Next week, if everything isn't covered, I'll post my review and screenshots. First year anniversery for me and have to take the wife out for the weekend so.. until next week.

Enjoy VG Beta 5 all.


Muli

/agree AoC FTW.

Hehehe, I was just kidding. Vanguard looks really nice. I'll play Vanguard and see how it goes. I will definitely be looking into AoC as well when it releases...then decide which game to stick with from there.

I have to agree. It's not the VG looks bad but, I don't know how much this will keep my interest. It's back to the ol' grind again. AoC seems like it's going to have a new twist to it and it's more PvP oriented. It's really a personal preference I guess from here on out. People can say they love it or hate but, this may be a great game for some people. I just not sure if it will be for me. I can talk about all my experiences in beta and so on but, i'm think this game will be a little different after launch.

Everquest made some big turn arounds at launch in comparison to it's beta.


Muli

I haven't seen anything in the screenshots that has impressed me yet. The giant squid is cool, but it's nothing that unique. The UI is pathetic, to say the least, and is an almost complete ripoff of the WoW default UI. Hell, it even has the quest log on the screen that looks identical to WoW.

Where are the pictures that make me say 'holy crap, that's awesome'? Where are pictures of mobs that make me want to go see them and slay them? I don't see any of that. I see EQ2. I see graphics worse than Oblivion. I see nothing new.

What I see is another eq2. A game that I might play for a few months till the shiny wears off and I realize its nothing more than another grind so I quit. :p I just have been having a hard time with getting into starting a new game all over again.

this game is better than eq2. that's for sure. while not a hard feat to accomplish, eq2 just outright sucks.

The WoW default UI was original? Reminded me of a cross between EQ and DAoC.

I think you'll find that default UIs are all pretty much the same and probably won't change significantly in the future.

But who cares, it's all about the mods.

Really the screenshots in this and other threads don't look special at all. It does look like EQ2 (been year for EQ2 for me tho, so my memory may be off) and it looks like a direct WoW UI ripoff more than others.

In the end it's all about gameplay, time will tell won't it?

Repeat after me, noone will use the default ui. Yes, it looks like the WoW ui, who cares. There are already a lot of custom uis made. The flexibility in ui customization is the best since eq. I use the default one because we are supposed to be testing, and testing the default ui is included in that imo. Yes, I have found and reported bugs in the default ui.

On combat. You are going to see a lot of reports from people that have played to 10 and from people that play but don't really use their skillsets. Combat is hard to master. Anyone can spam abilities, it is easy to do and you probably will still win most fights, expecially in a group. If you use your combat and casting effects to the detriment of mobs, you will kill much much faster and run a much lesser risk of death. In dungeons death can happen, and yes there are corpse runs. The respawn in most dungeons is fairly brisk and a inefficent group can have issues with backspawn.

On death. As it is right now, and probably won't change, you have options if you die. You can pay to summon your corpse at an altar (where you respawn) and take a rather large experience hit. Someone can drag your corpse (actually a tombstone) and get a rez. This gives you most of the exp back. You can recover your corpse yourself, again getting most of the experience back. I like the system as it is now. Most people that like to have some penatly to death will like it.

I agree with the peopel that say the screenshots look boring. Hell, overland travel, standing still doing nothing, and most busy work in games is boring. Dungeons are fun, really fun generally unless your group sucks, then you die. Outdoor dungeons can be fun but in Beta it has been hard to get groups to do those places since most people are wusses.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's the most customizable UI. I think that WoW still has the edge in that department.

Why can't they make a fully functional UI that people will embrace, rather than one that people will need to write their own code for in order to get the most out of? This isn't a complaint about VanguardQ specifically, but games in general. World of Warcraft seems to be learning and encorporating the better player-made mods into the game, but why can't a game like VanguardQ do the same thing?

"I know the UI sucks, but you can customize it if you know XML" is not exactly an answer to the problem. I shouldn't have to customize a terrible looking UI. It shouldn't be terrible looking in the first place.

Most if not all default UI's suck. Most of us will agree on that point. I'm really curious as to why (as we're talking about Vanguard in this thread) the Vanguard UI looks so damn much like the WoW one. It had to be a decision made by the dev's for a reason, and you know damn well they know it looks like the WoW one. Is it to make it easier for WoW players trying Vanguard to get used to the game (learning curve type issue)? Was it just easier to copy the most popular than spend the time to develop an unique look? Did they like the WoW default so much they couldn't help but copy perfection?

/ponder

Again, not that big a deal, I'm just curious as to the why.

I think its more that people want different things, and often more than the devs really planned on letting you have. Things like in WoW how you used to not be able to see your entire raid forces info like hp, mana, rage, energy without a mod. Now its been added in. It also might have to do with having a perfect default ui isnt tops on priority. Its enough to create one at the start that handles all the important things that every player will need. But just as wows and everquests interface has been changed, im sure this one will be too as demands start to surface and unsatisfactory options become more apparent.

Also, I didnt mean to imply that this game wont be any better than eq2, what I meant was, I find myself playing a new game, any new game, and giving up after awhile because I just cant get into them anymore. Its like my mind just refuses to allow for starting over from scratch yet again. After running the eq treadmill for several years, maxxing out a character in daoc, and now getting multiple 60s in WoW, I guess I just dont have the same tolerance I used to. Hell, maybe im just growing out of the genre period.

With a default UI, you pretty much have to cater to the lowest common demonimator. The people that can only run the game on minimal settings have to have a UI. That's why it's default. In the screenshots we've seen above, it appeared that Bigteeth was playing on a pretty low resolution which makes the UI look damn huge.

I think it's pretty natural to bring in things that work, even if they come from other games. WoW borrowed from it's predecessors and improved in some areas. I'm sure Vanguard will do the same for some aspects of the UI as well. I think it's relatively unfair to expect a game in beta to be as customizable as something like WoW. The fact is, we aren't fully aware of eveything the Vanguard UI can do yet, because we don't have a huge amount of UI modders onboard. There are a few, and some have come up with some pretty slick looking UI's, but there aren't a ton of them yet.

I find it hard to believe that you think they make a crappy, basic default UI just so people with lower-end computers can play the game. Is a good UI suddenly taxing on a system? News to me.

Yeah, I know what you are getting at. I am not including scripts and such since it will be difficult to make a UI for VG that runs itself. You will see some very good UIs ready to go upon release. Nothing quite as pretty as my final one for EQ, but pretty darn nice anyhow.

I don't think they made a crappy default ui just for the people with lower end computers. It isn't that good for lower end systems. I just think they devoted zero resources to it, which sucks. Like I said, noone will use that ui any longer than they have to, you will see good ones come out right away.

Not just for people with low end computers, no. I'm saying it's a factor. UI's can negatively impact performance if there is too much stuff thrown in.

Besides, whether or not it's a good UI is your opinion. It does what it needs to do. If you don't like it, you have the option to tailor it to your liking.

I don't have any major issues with the UI other than it's too big in it's default layout. Scaling down the windows is just fine for me.

EDIT: That isn't to say that I won't be using mods when they are available.

wows ui sucked dick in beta and in the beginning too, ya know

so did eq's

so did fucking everyones

who gives a shit? jesus christ

What are the Specs to run this game at Medium to High ?

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"Creating Havoc and Pie Since 2001!"
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Don't think actual specs have been released yet, sir.

Currently I am running it on a athlon 64 oc'd to 2.6ghz, 2gb of ram, 7800 video card and I'm not happy with the framerate I get on medium settings. There's little glitches I find that will drop it way down briefly, hopefully they get these fixed before release.

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-Rileigh (aka Golliwog)

Vanguard UI out of box is honestly 2nd to only EQ2s as far as customization goes.

Oh, and if you aren't running at least a dual core system, don't bother with this game. You will say it looks shitty when its not true at all. There are performance issues to be tweaked, but it starts with people realizing their 5 year old piece of shit is out of date and its time for new hotness.

Have the graphics of this game really changed that much, Givin, from September when you said,



Looking at the screenshots, it doesn't look much different from EQ2 to me.

I'm still pretty cynical about this game. I remember when a lot of you were too. I haven't seen anything yet that convinces me to jump the fence as quickly as some of you have. Convince me!

http://www.vanguardsoh.com/playersubmitted.php

those look great. just have to have a very nice computer to play it on the "good" settings.

I said it in one post and I will say it again...

I run the game side by side on 2 computers

A) Old comp glaspin built for me for 1000 dollars 4 years ago give or take, it was pretty decent at the time and let me raid EQ etc pretty good even though no sane person would raid with full part. effects on. The only single upgrade I have made is I put in a rad 9800 pro in it for like 150 dollars or something.

B) Brand new sexy computer that I built from scratch (first full building of a comp myself and it was stupid for me to try to build such a sexy one like this myself but oh well). I beleive the specs are below but I am not much of a comp guy so forgive me if i butcher some names.

Dual Core E6600 proccessor, NVIDIA 680 Sli mother board, NVIDIA GFX 8800 GTX (or s, the higher end one), 2 gig coir ram, etc. Got a nice wide screen 22" samsung monitor to boot.


I 2 box typically in VG so I have the joys of comparing the same area on a pretty top of the line machine of today and a slightly above average machine in its time 4 yrs ago. As far as FPS goes....old one I play with basically lowest settings minus a few things and range 7 fps to 25 fps depending on where I am in. The new one i play max settings and I get 30 - 75 fps (bare in mind i haven't touched any settings on the computer itself that supposedly effects performance like swamp file settings or any of that shit that I am clueless on).

Conclusions:

A) An old computer can handle playing this game but you aren't going to get to good of performance and it looks like old eq did on a average machine 7 yrs ago. Its still playable but if you are into the ooo's and awww's of graphics you just aren't going to be able to appreciate the game.

B) New computer....even without my internal optimization or the games "gold" optamization (and removal of debuffing which really does slow it down) the game runs flawlessly, I do not hitch and I zone (yes zone because no matter what you've been told, it does in fact have things that resemble zones) in a flash of the eye in MOST area's.

C) Graphics on high level are just breath taking in some area's....looking at SS's is one thing but actually playing in the environment is just...wow. For me being some one who never gave a shit about graphics (partially because I ran a pos walmart computer that didnt even come WITH a graphics card back in the day so i had to get some pos one) I must say it really does put you in wonder at times. Other places....ya who gives a shit. But man the first time you walk into khal's port you just stop and enjoy it. The clouds and sky adds alot to the game as well. It really is breath taking and im sorry but you have to be on some pretty good shit to actually say VG doesn't have the best graphics for a MMO period (which it should, its fucking 3rd gen "tm"). But as givin said....you NEED a good machine to enjoy the graphic aspect of VG. But you bet your ass in 2-3 years people are going to be happy that sigil made a game in mind with futuristic graphics (IF people are playing it still since yes obv its going to turn away alot of people if they can't play the game now on their old machines)


I have ALOT of issues with alot of recent decisions that were put in place that really seem to add artifical limits and remove the good old freedom that EQ gave you but those are more personal opinions that definitaly vary person to person. Personally Brad has really let me down in keeping his word on ALOT of issues and has flip flopped like Kerry.

That being said its still a good game. One thing I do not understand is how some people can say the combat is so boring. At worst its the same damn thing as every other MMO you play. To me it is pretty engaging as a sorc and depending on a lot of situations i do alot of different things. I haven't played all the classes yet so i can't speak for all but I do have alot of spells for various situations be it solo'n, dps grouping, AE solo'n, AE grouping, dps/CC group etc. Shit even by lvl 20 I bet i had 3 full hot key bars of spells that I used frequently. 2 boxing just is not going to be possible (effeciently at least like in eq) for some classes.

I'd write more but I think i've made my thoughts known on previous posts. The game isn't for everyone and it definitely isn't something i would really suggest to some one that just plays wow casually or really to any true casual player unless you want to do crafting (which the crafting is really a damn good system and this is coming from some one who has hated crafting in every game to date). So many things that they want to add "later" now that really could give the game that knock out punch power but unfortunately we are going to have to wait. But for fuck sakes I rather enjoy the start up of games and like the race to the top so I've done that for eq, eq2, L2, FFXI, wow (abit later in wow) etc and not a damn an even near complete game or mechanics out of the gate. Fuck EQ2 doesn't even resemble the game it once was (and they are paying for it sub wise). And yes in todays market we demand a much more finished product but lets not kid our selves, no one has exactly came out with a perfect release or had all the balances done etc.

But not gona lie.....money shortage or not, releasing the game in its current state might cost sigil the sub's in the long run that it needs to staff the post launch team enough to truly develop the game most of us expect in a timely manner (1-2 yrs). At least give it to the end of March and have all initial class revamps in place and all major bugs taken care of. Crafting incidents/injuries/etc has been broken for what a month+ now? Completely unacceptable considering these are things that need to be tested and see how they truly effect crafting leveling etc. I think my invis has been broke since it was given to us god knows how many months ago.

Meh...good game, just not the EQ killer!!! If it can bear the brunt of a release (and a very bad one at that if my thoughts are right) and stay afloat long enough to get the changes and balances that are needed then this game will provide an amazing place for a "niche" player base and be something many of us will play for many many years to come. AoC and LOTR don't do it for me so this is where I threw all my chips in as I have been following it since sigil formed. Good or bad im in till the ship sinks or they make a more strat based MMO based off a more FFT/Ogre Battle/Disegae type game.

It's day and night difference between bulds now. If you enjoy the game, its worth it to build a computer around it just so you can play on maximum settings. It does look like EQ2 still, on its lower settings. Turned up it's now in a class of its own. One of the first MMOs that i've seen that can have super awesome graphics and still play well and be fun.

This game will boast a crazy amount of content, for gamers of all walks of life. It already has enough scripted events in it that go light years beyond what Warcraft has to offer.

Classes seemed to each have their own niche, while obviously some seemed to overshadow others. Bloodmages are indeed, healers done right. You don't feel like a total helabot playing them. Some need some love, thats true but I think it will flesh out nicely.

Except for Bards. Bards are overpowered. No support class like that, even tho they are lumped in with the DPS, should be able to put out the same ranged hurt as a spellcaster or ranger. They will be the flavor of the month class to go along with Bloodmages.

I really wanted Inquisitor to go in for testing but it didn't happen. Psi's were pretty cool, and I could only imagine a tank hybrid of this. R.I.P. Berserker also.

Kojan starting area was my favorite. The test of ju quests, while some were pretty vague as to what the objective was, were really well thought out and very fun to complete. We also got decently far into the Goblin/Orc starting areas, but were cockblocked mid teens by broken quests.

As has already been said, the fact they pissed away months of time and money while under MS is going to hurt their launch and potentially their subscription base to the point they will have to settle for second fiddle.

Is the game good enough even for launch. Nope. I'm not going to lie about it. They have wasted too much resource on the past by goofing off and halfassing. The current team from what I understand has really busted ass over the past 6 months to even make the game playable in a beta sense.

But six months from now, when they catch up from their last teams failures, this will be a remarkable mmo experience. It was very fun for me to be able to go through and point out what was wrong with someone on the inside with me able to explain things. I did personally get a nasty sinkhole fixed as well as reported a handfull of broken quests and spawns, and that made me happy knowing I did exactly what one was supposed to do in a beta test.

Hoho i dl'd the client from fileplanet just to find out its US only. Made me cry irl. Well, close to.

-J.

I saw someone in ooc saying they were in the UK. So you might be able to play...

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Want...to...play.... /twitch

I haven't been able to log on at all since beta 5 started except for once when the game let me in a whole five minutes before crashing. Otherwise, I crash at server select.

Pre beta 5, I was able to play without many problems. Hopefully whatever it is will be fixed soon so that I can put the new video cards I am picking up Monday to use.

WOOT! I just got a beta key and I am downloading the beta now. WOOT!!!!

Two hours until it is done downloading... /twitch

I hope you hate it.

Me too...so I will feel less guilty about dumping it when AoC comes out. :p

After a loooong night i finally got it to work. Thanks Bzalthek, you brought me on the right track. Played two chars to 10 and i like it a lot so far. My comp doesnt, ill have to get a new one sometime soonish.

And is there really a place called Jalen's Crossing?

Yea, its near cai'al brael (raki/wood elf/kojani human land), all of Tanvu is pretty cool now, with cliffside ruins, tomb of lord tsang, and the Raki Spaceships.

A lot of the issues people are facing will be resolved when they go live and switch over to the Sony servers and a big pipe.

I have to agree with Givin about the game and the classes though. Screenshots don't do the game any justice. Playing it on a high end machine, the difference between even medium and highest settings is like night and day.

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"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats." -Henry Louis Mencken
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VEGETARIAN -Noun (vej-i-tair-ee-uhn): Ancient tribal slang for the village idiot who can't hunt, fish or ride.

There is a player housing island named after Jalen (one of the devs).

I just wish the damn thing would update. It's taking forever and a day for the fucker to patch for me. It'll be going along fine, than WHAM 100+ hours to go. Bleh.

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