Fribur wrote:
Old EQ people constantly complain that WoW has no community.
Let me offer an alternative explanation: we all got older.
1. We already built our community, and simply don't want to start again.
There were communities in games prior to EQ. The biggest difference was scale, and the need for community. Recall the shitlist, it did have an impact on people's play. Not every person on it mind you. For example Miramicha was on it and it was a technically valid shitlisting...yet he was not someone that should be "avoided at all costs" which people realized. I doubt it seriously impacted his gaming, though it probably was an annoyance. Other people who were giant asshats found that being held accountable for their actions impacted their ability to play the game at higher levels. Even when a community like ours gave them multiple chances.
Pretty much every aspect of the game required community, this lessened with some expansions (such as buying and selling became 'easier' with vendors, and required less interaction between individuals). But for the most part, the people you played with had you logging in as much if not more at times than the content.
I'm not saying that's not the case with World of Warcraft, but I certainly didn't feel too shitty about blowing off raids in WoW. I didn't need a community to quest or group really. I could log in and know no one and entertain myself. It's not that you can't make a community which is why people gaming there with EQ people (or Lanys people) have a much stronger sense of community.
They also tend to be more successful in these games because they know how to work and play well together. IMHO. But WoW depends far less on 'community' and interplayer relationships. Again, IMO.
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2. Add to that, it's going to be impossible for any game to compete with our nostalgia.
Yes, and no. I'm a gamer from the days of pong. Seriously my dad bought pong (not on release, when it was cheaper later). I had a PC when few did because of the type of work my dad did that allowed him to bring an IBM home. (yaaaay!) So I played Sierra games, such as King's Quest, when they were released. And Atari, and then Nintendo, etc.
Just when you thought things were the absolute best...they got better. Sometimes they got worse. We shall not speak of the blasphemy which is Nintendo 64. Or Dreamcast. Or many other horrors.
But gaming always improved, as technology improved. And technology went forward by leaps and bounds. It's slowed down now, or so it seems. It's not that improvements don't happen, but it's primarily eye candy. Games 'look' better, but there's been nothing too revolutionary in PC gaming. There's new concepts mind you (such as the evolution game, Spore, etc.) And consoles are jumping ahead with Wii's new controller. Which will allow for more gaming innovation.
But MMOs are a little stagnant. It's not that it hasn't gotten better, because many aspects have. In game mail? Very nice. Auction house type set ups? Essential. Questing as it exists in most games now...much better. But it's not revolutionary. It's merely evolution of the same design.
I think a good analogy is a car. Holy shit, a car, wow no carriage for me. And while they've gotten faster and prettier...it's still a car. We keep talking about flying cars...or maybe even teleportation, but the former hasn't happened and the latter won't happen for people probably in our lifetime (if ever). It's kinda like that. There's new and spiffier...but it's still a car.
Doesn't mean that we won't find one that we love more than our first car though. But it won't be the same 'newness'. That doesn't make it impossible to compete with, just that you'll never have that exact feeling. But it has the potential to be even better.
The DS surprised me. Wii is going to blow me away, I know that. Hopefully PC games will have something with that new/amazing factor in the future too
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3. We are no longer in high school (obviously this doesn't apply to all of us). The flaming and silly huge dramatic arguments over stupid shit that entertained us in EQ and made us feel like part of a group no longer entertain us.
Drama is always entertaining, more so when it's not your drama. EQ's community factor had dynamics which threw people into direct competition and ...well fighting. Our community was better at dealing with these things than many EQ communities (again IMO, but it's also true :p). While there were fights, and drama...there was also a lot of working things out. While I'm not saying WoW isn't competitive, it's not even close to the same thing. Not even with PvP.
But, I also don't think it was a good thing. A game with the dynamic to allow other people the ability to control what you can and cannot access by might tends to suck for the majority of players who aren't in the elite. Granted the elite or higher end guilds will get to do and see more by the sheer factor of what they can accomplish, but that's quite different from a group of people cockblocking your content access.
However, many people liked this aspect of gaming. I didn't.
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4. It's impossible for any game to compete with our nostalgia.
It's a trap! wasn't this already said?
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5. Those in WoW as their first mmorpg seem to think there is plenty of community.
Much in the same way a virgin tends to think of whatever sex they're getting as fantastic. If you have no basis for comparison, even shitty sex seems fantastic. If you've had really really good sex, well...you'll notice a lousier lay. Doesn't mean you won't take it if there's nothing better, but you'll be thinking about the good sex, and missing it.
I get the feeling for most people WoW is like a dildo. It's better than nothing and can be lots of fun...and you don't have to deal with going out or finding someone else. But few people are satisfied with just that. Okay since most of you are guys, replace 'dildo' with 'your right hand'. Or left for about 10% of you wankers.
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6. If you say in reply to number 5, "they just don't know any better," well, it's impossible for any game to compete with our nostalgia.
This was said twice before! And to stick with my sex analogy because I'm liking it, it's like saying once you've had the best lay of your life...all other sex sucks in comparison. Not true. Or to go with my old gaming analogy...pong was fun, but I don't sit around wishing for the days of pong. Or saying no game can compare to it simply because it was first, and amazing at the time.
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7. Raiding in WoW still requires "community." The fact that it is instanced doesn't change the fact that guilds have to work together on a nightly basis to beat that content. Perhaps larger scale community is a bit more difficult, but on the guild level it seems as strong as it ever was in EQ.
Raiding in WoW != raiding in EQ. Retarded monkeys on crack can (and do) raid most content in WoW. Granted we had some easily raidable content in EQ too especially as time went on and shit got dumbed down. But seriously...do you remember the early days of plane of fear? Do you remember CR that took
days. Someone pulling a Leroy Jenkins would have been shitlisted and people would have fantasized about traveling back in time with a coat hanger and visiting his mom.
I'm not saying I want the old days of CRs that took freakin' days. Or long long long hours. It sucked balls. But risk v. reward meant something.
In WoW really with most raids, what's required other than the right classes showing up. (I said *most* raids
)
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8. It's impoosible for any game to compete with our nostalgia.
Yeah I think I'm going to forget getting a Wii and just ask my dad if he still has the old pong machine. Because really, that's what gaming is all about. Old school, biatches!!!1111
Or not. I want a wii. Someone go wait in line for me.