biz.yahoo.com/iw/060505/0127515.html<
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Eat it, and suck a dick. I told you it would happen.<
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Enjoy Everquest 3. <
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Oh, and before anybody comes back with that great Brad quote about how they are maintaining creative control over the game....<
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He said the same thing about 989/Verant before selling out.<
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/DX Suck It Crotchchops <
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SOEwned <i></i>

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This is great, great stuff <
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/pizza <i></i>

Yeah thats like owned x100000<
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I just read this shit a second ago and I laughed my ass off. <i></i>

Vanguard Forums are funny now!<
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This one even has the Smedster in it! <i></i>

ROFLMAO.<
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Actually Givin, weren't you like the first to call it a couple of years ago? I don't mean just on this board, I mean like...period. The Birth of Tarot (NSFW)<
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Keep my head from exploding?...<b>You can help!</b><i></i>

Oh yeah, I think the first time I ever heard about Vanguard was Givin talking about this. <i></i>

that is indeed funny<
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the part where they call it ground
eaking, SoE part is funny too! <i></i>

As being my only real possibility of getting back into online gaming, I died abit inside hearing SOE will be doing CS and all that shit <
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Good work dumbshits, money >>> your game I guess. <i></i>

I wonder if the All Access pass will see a price increase. =o <i></i>

You mean another increase? It just went up in price this month. <i></i>

Quote:AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA<
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I want to be a jingoistic tosser when I grow up.<i></i>

Well at least today is already cloudy and miserable, I won't notice the gloom so much after this announcement. ---------<
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Fisbo, Gnome Rogue - Knights of Arcadia - Dark Iron<i></i>

Haha. <
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Love my station pass! <i></i>

Vanguard will be the death of WoW!!1 Kuwen Furyblades<
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I dunno. Not that I'll be playing Vanguard, but if I did, I think I'd be more comfortable with Sony behind it than M$. I don't know karate, but I know ka-RAZY!!<i></i>

If anyone is interested in acquiring a slightly used rubber ducky lemme know. <i>Edited by: Snarky00 at: 5/10/06 11:17 am<
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Just curious, what's the big selling point of Vanguard? <
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That is, other than being bigger and better, what's different from it and the other hack/slash MMORGS? <i></i>

It was made by Brad.<
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Thats the only thing going for it.<
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Chey Ironfounder, Member of the VGRPU<
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From my limited experience I would say the selling points may include:<
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A) Indepth combat (counter attacks, counter spells, saves, etc). They might actually have got it right producing something that doesn't let you sit there and sleep during combat but isn't SO confusing and busy work that you don't enjoy it. They slowed the actual combat down for the required amount of thinking that happens.<
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B) 3 spheres..(its bad in my eyes but to each their own) of combat, crafts and diplomancy. You can actually group craft etc, I never got into that side much so not sure how indepth it is.<
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THere is alot of innovated ideas dealing with quests and combat etc that a FAQ would do much better justice describing. It also has no instances!!!! I haven't played in awhile so not sure how its shaping up but it has a better concept then any game to date for me at least. Unfortunately switching over to SOE made me a lot less encouraged to check it out again <i></i>

Could be worse, could be run by Blizzard....... <
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Yeah ok... <i></i>

Vanguard looked bad from the beginning. Did something change here? =p <i></i>

Not really. Vanguard's biggest selling point was the lack of SOE. It's combat was defined, even by its beta testers as "shitty and boring". Everyone flocked to Brad because he did EQ and SOE fucked him over. Now he returns to the gracious em
ace of SOE because his game sucks donkey balls and he didn't want to play nice with Microsoft.<
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Now, I got issues with MS too, but fuck, if they had even read their own forums they should have had an inkling of the utter hate afforded SOE. I think they either didn't have a choice but to go with SOE or they are all terminally stupid. <i></i>

Guarentee this is how it went down.<
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Sigil says "We will be happy with a low subscriber base, we don't want to compete with other markets."<
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Microsoft, hot off their utter failure console, the XBOX 360, says, "Huh? Oh we don't think so." Seeing a failure blooming already, they dump their half of Sigils shit back on top of them and piss them to the wind. They then realize they are bit players in the gaming industry and terminate a shitload of people from their own gaming divisoin.<
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Brad "Double Whopper" McQuaid, having nowhere else to turn gets on the horn with his old buddy Smeds. If anybody can convince a group of fanboys that a giant turd is worth selling its the Smedman. <
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All that creative control bullshit is just a smokescrean. A panic button response to try and not get every single person that followed this game for what it was, not a SOE product, to not bail out on them.<
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You know it, I know it. He can state all he wants about how its still his baby. What happens when Smeds comes to him every 3 months wanting that adventure content pack pushed reguardless of whats ready to go and how tuned it is. Its going to utter hilarity to watch SOE slowly slip its hand into Brads baby girls panties and grope around untill they reach the honeypot, and there is jack shit now he can do about it. <
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The info says it's just a distribution/publisher deal. Likely won't hurt the initial release, but in time SOE has a way of corrupting it's products for $$$. <
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Would have never happened if WoW wasn't dominating the market.<
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Not sure how to feel on this, but always thought Microsoft as a backer was a strange choice. Surprised they didn't shop NCSoft.<
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NCSoft probably wanted an actual deliverable. <i></i>

Fucking slime fucking soe.<
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I don't care who owns it, or what it is called. I will still try it out. Seven years of playing EQ 1, someone is bound to get it right and come out with a game that will keep my attention for more than a month. Masjaun<i></i>

My hope for this genre is now dashed like a baby's head against a rock. ---<
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vanamar<
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modern day heresies<
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dieinachurchfire.org (coming soon!)<
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my livejournal<i></i>

It is amazing how little this matters to me. I am sure I will line up to buy it when it comes out just like most of the poeple saying they won't. <i></i>

Nah, I will wait several months and wait for the initial shock to die down. Buying hot is buying stupid. <i></i>

But then you can't be the first to 50 !!!!<
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And while the game will in fact lose some of its player base because of this they might also pick up some SOE player base (not that we want them) so I guess time will tell. Still a very sad turn of events but I really suggest you don't get too opinionated about the game just yet. The mechanics are definitly there to produce a good game, I am more worried about how they are going to excute it...have we actually ever had a game that had end raid content ready or one that was released with no major game altering bugs? I would be fine with the game being pushed back even further if just for once a game came out as a commerical product, not a BETA testing that we pay for. <i></i>

I was a big believer in Vanguard, but unfortunatly this game just sucked in Beta (and still does). Why does it suck you ask? The game is just not fun...no other way to describe it. Two words: Not Fun. The change in publisher isn't going to change the fact that this is going to be a crappy game. Just who's going to get the blame when it tanks. I kind of think these two deserve each other. Hell, maybe some good can actually come out of this and these two can put Humpty Dumpty back together again. EQ through Velious was a great game, and it was these two guys that did it. Maybe if they haven't completly sold out they can do it again (fat chance I'm thinking). <i></i>

Didn't some Beta testers get banned for "exploiting"? <i></i>

--Paying for music or movies is so 1990.<i></i>

WTPlay beta PSinbox message. <i></i>

Been in beta since beta 2, but never actually played it since the game didn't like my graphics card and didn't allow me to play =P. And now with a new vid card I can't download the game as they have blocked the download from fileplanet indefinately. Shrug, this account might go on ebay! hah. <i></i>

OoooOOoo send me a message if you're getting rid of it!!! Masjaun<i></i>

To the people whining about EQ CS, stop posting. <
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Everquest customer service is a lot better than most others.<
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Then again, maybe my point of view is skewed since we had GM's shadowing our raids when I was in LoS. <i></i>

ok <i></i>

Takes a day or so for Blizz CS to respond to tickets. My warlocks felhound quest was bugged since like lvl30 and they never responded to that petition at ALL. Guess the guy not giving me the next chain of the quest is working like its supposed to. <
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Blizzard CS was ATROCIOUS.<
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EQ's CS wasn't exactly stellar either though.<
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The worst part about Blizzard CS is that they won't even TRY to make you happy about the situation. A few times I unloaded on EQ GM's and they'd say, "Ok, ok, look, how about a 100% xp rez and a port home, ok?" Blizzard GM's just say, "Hm. Well, it's a known issue, but too bad. Thank you for choosing World of Warcraft."<
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But overall, neither of them are very good. <i></i>

Quote:Everquest customer service is a lot better than most others.<
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Uh, ok, whatever you say... <
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After having played EQ for about 5 years, and playing for short periods of time a number of other MMORPG's including UO, AO, DAOC, CoH, FFXI, AC - I received better customer service for each of those games for the short periods of time that I played them than I EVER did while playing EQ. SOE is the worst; bar-none in my opinion. Blizzard beats their CS hands down as well. <i></i>

I'd have to agree with Venen, Blizzard isn't doing that great either, but they beat SOE by a mile. <i></i>

I'd have to agree with Venen too. Although I've not needed much in the way of support from Blizzard, what I've gotten there and in other MMORPGs was better than what I got from SOE. <
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I'm sure people get shitty service from all games they play. <i></i>

After the 39 page thread I assume they realize how many people they will probably lose with this decision, but I really wonder if they considered that before they met with SOE. God, It's amazing how much they have fucked themselves now.<
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I dunno, to me it does seem a little sad that someone would decide to not play a game solely based on the fact that SOE was publishing it. Beads!<i></i>

Learning from experience is sad /nod <i></i>

Screw me once, shame on you. Screw me twice, shame on me.<
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Maybe? <i></i>

What experience? That SOE took over EverQuest and that a 7 year old MMO is...well, old? Seriously, everyone throws hate at SOE mindlessly, but I can't think of anything that they really did that was truly worthy of it all. <
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Honestly, the only thing that most people who jumped on the SOE-hate bandwagon have to say is, "Kunark and Velious were the best expansions, thus, SOE = Satan." Beads!<i></i>

Firstly, i'm back from vacation, and I have read this little nugget.<
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Quote:To the people whining about EQ CS, stop posting.<
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Then again, maybe my point of view is skewed since we had GM's shadowing our raids when I was in LoS.<
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which I will answer with another quote...<
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Quote:AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHA<
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Now, onto actual smart stuffs that Bovine wrote.<
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I'm sure 95% or more of the people that play or used to play Star Wars Galaxies have numerous counterpounts to your argument. This cannot be overlooked, as it is a major part of SoE's franchise. Just because it doesn't carry the EQ name, doesn't mean it cant be counted against them.<
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How many "Shoot first, ask questions later" scenarios have they gone though, not counting the famous ones on Lanys? How shitty have they handled it? Easier to just slap bans and publicly embarras people than admit their own product had flaws and was incomplete. A 30 foot tall male human model in the place of the Sleeper? O schnap, ok sure we're wrong but trade us in your Primal Weapons and we'lll unban your friends. Cant log into our servers after a crash, but you are at Emperor Ssra? Not a problem, just use our own written technical assistance guide listing the multiple login server addresses that you may try. Oh, but if you get in, we auto ban you for "hacking". It goes on and on.<
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Shitty unfinished content at release? It almost became commonplace, and a lot of us now that still game, no matter where it be are probably still adjusting to actually getting content that works. Expansion after expansion on a stupid 3 month timetable designed nothing more to fuel the beta test that would become EverQuest 2. Not that I harbor ill to EQ2, I actually quite liked the game and it would be cool to see it succeed. But this really bothers me.<
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Don't act like its that simple to turn a blind eye to all the horseshit practice they pulled. The argument that SoE will not have dev control on this project is a smoke screen. The game launches, and SoE thinks its in their best interest as a publisher to see content rushed out the door asap to tap into the highest margin of sales, rather than produce quality tested material ready for consumer use.<
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You are going to have to dig a little deeper than an argument over a favorite expansion. You know as well as I do the very reasons we kept drinking the SoE Kool-Aid. There wasn't anything else coming out, or released that we A...didn't want to invest time in and B...had existing ties and relationships to people playing the same game we already were.<
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It's a whole new ballgame now. With options avalable to casual and competitive gamers alike. Like it or not, those experiences gamers have had in the past with companies will dictate the rise and fall of this product. Word of mouth is the strongest point of advertising in this market, and at this stage, they better pull a golden goose out of their ass and make it work, because its obvious who is going to rule this decade of mmo gaming. Everone else can fight for 2nd place. I'm not suggesting boycott their product or parading that they are indeed the devil. But lets compare it to the automotive industry. Knowing its track record in the past, would you willingly go purchase a Ford Fierro? And lets say, you were at one point the owner of a Ford Fierro, and it burst into flames, would that not make you a little wary of Ford as a whole?<
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Or, the short and sweet version....<
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I'd wait for SEVERAL months worth of reviews on this, from multiple sources before I went that route. Nothing, and I strongly believe nothing is worth planning on a move at this point over your current MMORPG of choice. <
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Quote:How many "Shoot first, ask questions later" scenarios have they gone though, not counting the famous ones on Lanys? How shitty have they handled it? Easier to just slap bans and publicly embarras people than admit their own product had flaws and was incomplete. A 30 foot tall male human model in the place of the Sleeper? O schnap, ok sure we're wrong but trade us in your Primal Weapons and we'lll unban your friends. Cant log into our servers after a crash, but you are at Emperor Ssra? Not a problem, just use our own written technical assistance guide listing the multiple login server addresses that you may try. Oh, but if you get in, we auto ban you for "hacking". It goes on and on.<
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This is all 100% true, but we gotta be honest, this stuff isn't only restricted to SOE. Look how ban-happy Blizzard has been for instance. They've even banned guild bankers and totally innocent people for no reason. Hell, right before I quit one of my friends was suspended because an item he placed on the AH was purchased by a "suspected farmer". So he got suspended pending investigation, and they took the item AND the gold from selling it. He was real happy. And stuff like server crashes when you're almost to Ragnaros or something? I don't think they've ever even tried coming out and making that right for anyone.<
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Quote:Shitty unfinished content at release? It almost became commonplace, and a lot of us now that still game, no matter where it be are probably still adjusting to actually getting content that works.<
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Well, to be honest, FFXI was probably the *only* MMO where I haven't seen or heard about some content being crappy, unfinished or really buggy. And to SOE's credit people say that things have been a lot better since the fiasco that was the GoD era, though I'm just going by what people say for this, I haven't actually seen it. I have seen how they're handling the new progression server though, and it does seem like they're really trying to take it seriously and listen to players (within reason) and put out something good.<
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Now I'm not trying to bash WoW here at all...I'd have to say that overall Blizzard *definately* has a better track record than SOE. I guess my point is that yes, I totally agree that SOE's policies and actions have sucked, but it seems like this kind of bullshit has pretty much become par for the course in the MMO industry.<
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Quote:The argument that SoE will not have dev control on this project is a smoke screen. The game launches, and SoE thinks its in their best interest as a publisher to see content rushed out the door asap to tap into the highest margin of sales, rather than produce quality tested material ready for consumer use.<
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Totally agree, no company foots the bill for something and then dosen't want a say in how it goes.<
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But anyway, I don't think that SOE is a great company, but I also don't think that it's fair to claim that all the ills of the MMO industry lay at their feet. And yes, I still think it's sad that people who were previously interested in a game would now say that they won't have anything to do with it just because SOE is now paying the bills.<
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Well, to be honest a lot of people were only interested in it because it wasn't SOE in conjunction with Brad & Krew. <i></i>

Quote:Well, to be honest, FFXI was probably the *only* MMO where I haven't seen or heard about some content being crappy, unfinished or really buggy<
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that could be because by the time you get it, its already been released for like a year or two over seas. <i></i>

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I am in the wait and see boat. Presently the beta is well.. beta.<
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It 'feels' like EQ original gameplay. The new world without hand holding is there. There isnt the golden arrows pointing you to safe area. You get lost. you die, you struggle.<
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Its an adventure. Performance on most machines is a major issue atm. as is the art... most just say its too
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I havnt played since I was in summer session, but I repatched this afternoon and am planning on takin a look at it again while taking a
eak from EVE. I do fear the SOE connection. EQ1 was ok till Kunark because the Brad design krew was in effect but they were loosing ground quickly .. and I dare say they were loosing focus. What they originally inteded was to flesh out the inner zones of the old world before shooting for the moon (ick).<
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Anyway, I prefer MS over SOE but I am not a member of the Sigil team and thus have no say in the decision just opinions.<
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SoE cos isnt that bad. we were raiding labs in eq2 and vyemm gfluxed tank onto a ledge and when vyemm died the loot chest spawned ON the ledge (. we coudlnt get to the loot so we petitioned and had a gm there summoning loot winners to the chest in 5min.<
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